I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

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1129 days, 18 hours, 43 minutes ago

edward jellico

I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's call it the Storm Class SuperDeathStarkiller Dreadnought.
10 Beams/10 Torps/10 Fighter Bays
Special Ship Mission: Ion Storm Generator

Webmines are currently underpowered and Crystals should be able to generate mini ion storms that can obscure entire 150LY web minefields preventing them from being swept.
Rather than just have ion storms benefit the Crystals haphazardly, they should be able to harness this game changing mechanic in a directed and deliberate fashion.

We don't want anyone to be able to intercept and destroy such a vessel so thats why we need 10 of everything so it can defend itself.

1129 days, 18 hours, 34 minutes ago

geckoo

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

You forgot something! A coffee machine in the bridge.
;-)

1129 days, 18 hours, 24 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

10 extra advantage points for the coffee machine sounds reasonable. Add in five for the ion storm generator and we have a very reasonable ship for 15 advantage points.

1129 days, 17 hours, 11 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

In one of the old mods for the original VGA Planets (It might have been the Jupiter Mod), the Colonials had the ability to change direction, weaken and/or strengthen its charge. Maybe give that ability to a special ship of a different race, to increase odds that people would find that race valuable as an ally?

iirc, the way you modified direction was changing the name of the ship in question, and modifying its friendly code to IOC (IOn storm Control). Maybe in this case, just give it a special mission, with the friendly code determining what direction to head and whether or not it modifies charge?

The Mod explained that the Colonials, with their advanced stellar engineering (with Ramscoops), they had advanced understanding of how to control the storms. But really, this could be applied to any race. I would be hesitant to give the ability to the Crystals, however, since it would give them way too much of an advantage.

1129 days, 14 hours, 16 minutes ago

singularity

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Edward

The problem with that design is that you may want the Ion storm over a far off web minefield. And while the ramscoops would get the SCSDSKD (catchy name btw) there in time, the better (and clearly superior option) would be to add Super Quantum 11/10 Hyperspace engines too.

Given it is a bigger ship than those puny probes the Super Quantum 11/10 Hyperspace engine should be able to jump 2000ly for 50 fuel. And you need precision with those Ion storms, so obviously you need to allow it to jump anywhere in that radius not just to the edges.

+1 Advantage should cover that.

I'm also thinking that other races might get jealous of it. So maybe -50 advantages points for that.

1129 days, 14 hours, 2 minutes ago

griffin

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Your sarcasm barely hides your tears. Stop crying.

1129 days, 14 hours, 2 minutes ago

obazda

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Maybe the next crys emperor will add an anti Crystal ship to all races instead, who knows.

1129 days, 5 hours, 39 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Griffin

Thanks for your intelligent and thoughtful reply on the topic of

"Ion Storms - their haphazard, far reaching, and disproportionate advantages for one race."

1129 days, 5 hours, 21 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

How about to further balance it by making it a race only feature?

So if anyone does take it over it does not work?

Actually make it player slot only. Even if another Crystal takes it over it does not generate ion storms.

Or how about if it is captured in any way it self destructs taking all non crystalline ships into the void. Obviously leaving Crystaline ships behind. Possibly this void energy also repairs all Crystaline ships and fills their cargo bays with torps when this happens as well?

:-)

1129 days, 3 hours, 28 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

...or stop letting the Crystal win Emperor games!?!

Rules 1-3

Kill the Borg
Kill the Crystal
Kill the Privs

It really is important to follow these rules.

1129 days, 3 hours, 20 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Too bad no one listened to that rule in the current Emork Champ game.

1129 days, 3 hours, 10 minutes ago

griffin

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Edward_Jellico You do know ions have the same effect on normal mine fields too, right?

1129 days, 2 hours, 58 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Griffin

Yes I am, that's why I plan on counter mining with regular minefields so my mines can be cloaked as well. But you can sit in my cloaked mines with no harm.

My ships sitting in webmines - different story.

1129 days, 2 hours, 29 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Don't forget to add an Improbability Drive!

1129 days, 2 hours, 24 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Also, it really should have two..... no three shield generators so that when the first set of shields are exhausted the next one takes over.

1129 days, 1 hours, 8 minutes ago

crimzonzun

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

A Ship with 10 Fighters and 10 Torps with 10 Beams Gz A Fed or would love that thing specially if it had shield boost also. As the Horwasp trust me the Brood, Solider and Hive proves how good the Combo is having Fighters and Torps and FREE to boot.

I Believe the Crystals just got a new ship that did Pull/Push of a Webmine field.

IF anyone Could used a ship would be the races that do not have clone. Perhaps couple more of there ships could used edge up to make them stronger in a Game.

Trust me i Know MBR it would be nice if it had 50 more Mass to the thing enough to eat 1 Mine Hit.

IF anything if Crystals had to have something as a Boost why not 1 Free Torp for every Torp tech level at Starbase. They could make them into Web or Normal mines.
Just 1 Torp for each level means would have to have different Launchers on different ships to used them all but would they would have them.

1129 days, 0 hours, 21 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Sounds like the problem is the ion storms, not the webmines/ regular minefields. You complaint should be properly directed.

The cloaking of minefields and the inability to sweep while they are in them is your primary issue... no need to drag a race in whose primary and only weapon is its mines. Robots are also just a affected.

No disagreeing with you or supporting... neutral on this one. Just disagreeing with you singling out the Crystals as the issue, when it clearly is not.

1129 days, 0 hours, 21 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

I think there exists a slight possibility that the original post was intended to convey a degree of irony.

Though, to address a serious point: Both the Robots and the Colonies also benefit disproportionately from ion storms. And both should, IMO.

1128 days, 23 hours, 57 minutes ago

qinic

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

There is also the possibility it was sarcasm.

1128 days, 23 hours, 37 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Lord+Pollax

You are correct that the primary symptom is the ion storm itself. However, the reaction of the races to the presence of ion storms speaks volumes to its beneficiaries and disproportionate nature :

Federation: ugg
Lizards: uggg
Birdmen: uggg
Fascists: uggg
Pirates: ugggggg
Borg: ugg
Crystals: WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Empire: ugg
Robots: cool!
Colonies: whatever! Starbuck and Apollo can still shoot down mines no problem.

Primary Issue:
Sudden formation of Ion Storms that can shove the entire balance of games without warning. ('Tip' the balance would understate the degree of the problem)

Secondary Issue:
Cannot see or sweep mines that are external to the ion storm if the center is obscured. Maybe as much as 100LY external. This does not make sense.

Tertiary Issue:
Should the outcome of a 4 month chess match be determined by a hurricane that completely rearrange the pieces on the board?

1128 days, 23 hours, 36 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Birds don't care about Ion Storms unless they are fighting Crystals or Robots.

1128 days, 23 hours, 32 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Bacchus

Even if expensive, Birdmen at least have the option of countermining if the effort is wortwhile.

1128 days, 23 hours, 32 minutes ago

griffin

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Chess is definitely more interesting in a hurricane. Plus, as mere mortals, we can't really say, "Hey, can we get no hurricanes? That would be great for my chess game in New Orleans, thanks!"

1128 days, 23 hours, 11 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@edward+jellico counter-mining the Robots as the Birds, though technically possible, is a nightmare that most Bird commanders would dread considering.

My point was your chart about how races react to an Ion Storm, for the most part the Birds don't care too much. Yes, it can be a pain if a powerful storm crashes through your economic base, but Resolutes and Dark Wings are impervious to Ion Storms.

1128 days, 23 hours, 5 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Bacchus

You could be a bird bankrolled by the Lizards or Federation. In either case, you can sit still or counter-mine but that misses the main point.

Can you counter-mine or sit still in a cloaked web mine field that was placed on top of you at random?

1128 days, 23 hours, 1 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Actually, the Cyborg don't usually mind ion storms all that much. Chunnel, dontcherknow.

1128 days, 22 hours, 26 minutes ago

captain storm

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Wow, that ship sounds WAY overpowered!

While we are at it to balance the game out, why not give EACH race a tech 10 ship with 10 beams, 10 torps, and 20 fighter bays with a max cargo of 1000! Let's also make it cheap to build, both in minerals and mc!

And each ship would have a special racial advantage tailored for that particular race!

Then we just sit back and watch the space battles! FUN! FUN! FUN!

SERIOUSLY? That ship suggestion was a joke, right? Because if not, then mine isn't either!

1128 days, 22 hours, 26 minutes ago

captain storm

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Wow, that ship sounds WAY overpowered!

While we are at it to balance the game out, why not give EACH race a tech 10 ship with 10 beams, 10 torps, and 20 fighter bays with a max cargo of 1000! Let's also make it cheap to build, both in minerals and mc!

And each ship would have a special racial advantage tailored for that particular race!

Then we just sit back and watch the space battles! FUN! FUN! FUN!

SERIOUSLY? That ship suggestion was a joke, right? Because if not, then mine isn't either!

1128 days, 22 hours, 23 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

"People who refuse to learn from other posts in the feed history are doomed to repeat them."
-Abraham Lincoln

1128 days, 19 hours, 28 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

I personally hate ion storms, and prefer to play without them.

That said, I would point out that I also hate star clusters... and the races that get all giddy when they are near them with their radiation fields covering a gaggle of planets (Fascists come to mind).

I also hate playing the Pirates and getting to start inside a nebula. Talk about fun!

Asteroid fields also suck... unless they are next to my core worlds. And I'm playing the EE.

All these features alter the "balance". I honestly prefer a more straight up version of VGAP where chance is less of an issue and player skill the deciding factor... not some 350 megavolt storm passing through my core at turn 10.

1128 days, 19 hours, 1 minutes ago

crimzonzun

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Hate say it i Do perfer there is some Random stuff in the game. Sure Star Clusters might not be your cup of Tea, at the same time they block a path for most cloakers if you ever thought of that Non of the Rad Shielding ships have Cloak. And Robots the Only ones immune to the Radiation if they started getting Cloakers that could be good twist in a game.

As for Nebula SO it helps hides your movements some and such not like it really hurts much.

Asteroid fields SO no Large Mass ship can enter the thing you realize how much resources are to be had on them. And they also can have Natives inside of them. You have a World next to it and you can supply TONS of resources out.

Horswasp on other hand Love Fields also :) Throw a Soldier in there with Clans and such and you can have your Own little Stinger/Brood Making Factorys. Also Can Bring out resources and Build a Hive or Acceletor.

As for the Mega Storms Yes. IF Anything the Shielding which is worth 5 Points its to bad its not just active Anyways. Not like every race does not have 5 points they could spare cause none them is hitting 500 to start and all games start with the default.

That would help the races with Ship yards and such out.

NOT sure Horswasp should get that Ability Only planets it would mess up is 10+ Turn ships. Most worlds are within 4 turns and at best you wait out the storms.

1128 days, 18 hours, 13 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Lord+Pollax hits the nail on th head. Certain features like ion storms, star clusters and the like have no place in as 'defaults' in system generated games. It would be less of any issue if they were 30 minute Starcraft II skirmishes but we are talking months of time for a single game.

I am considering switching my primary race to the Facists and would benefit greatly from star clusters. Putting myself in the shoes of someone else, I can see how terrible it would be if they can't access any of their planets from just plain random draw.

Ion storms are magnitudes worse than any other feature because you can't plan for them. Your fine one turn and dead the next.

1128 days, 9 hours, 50 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

I'm not sure I agree with you entirely, Pollax and Jellico. I mean, I do like the randomness, and half the map is brought back into balance by the existence of ion storms.

I do think they could use some work, mind. And ideally, the discussion should have its own thread, because if I were to list all the things wrong with ion storms, we'd go a long way outside the scope of this one.

1128 days, 8 hours, 35 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

The main problem I have with all the random features is that, without exception, they benefit the more powerful races.

Ion storms benefit the Crystals and Borg, and screw cloakers.
Nebula benefit all HC races, and screw cloakers.
Debris disks are neutral, noone much gives a rats ass except the EE. (I don't even bother to mine them anymore to be honest)

If we want randomization, let's make it randomized.

In addition to ion storms which make sweeping webs impossible, lets add anti-neutrino storms which destroy webmines.

In addition to nebulae, which make cloaking races have trouble, lets add a random gravity field over planets which make it harder for the big carriers to enter.
(i know...asteroid fields can do this, but since they don't count for victory purposes, we can ignore them) I'm not against randomness in war games, since random events historically are huge; I'm just against the fact that the randomness in this game is all to the benefit of the better races.

(and yes, I know the birds are not affected bla blah blah, but they suck anyway, that's a situation for another discussion)

(Also, yes, I know I can play classic or custom, thanks in advance for the suggestions)

1128 days, 7 hours, 47 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

I'm not sure that ion storms do anything other than introduce chaos into the game. That chaos usually has far more impact on game finishes than any random game feature, excepting the asteroid fields potentially (in the proper hands of folks who know how to use them).

Storms degrade minefields, if I understand correctly, same as radiation fields. I'm good with that. Not being able to scan for mines or sweep them (other than Colonial fighters, which makes zero sense) is the actual complaint I am hearing.

I can understand the scan issue and agree that scanning should be impaired. Ships should not be visible either though, if this logic is used. I think minesweeping should still be allowed, albeit at a reduced efficiency. Perhaps halving the beams, or causing the beams to act as 1/2 their tech level. Shooting beams at random as the description states should yield minesweeping whether I can see or not, if I sit in a minefield.

I disagree about the Borg complaints concerning ion storms, as they gain nothing they don't already have. Chunnel is nasty no matter the weather.

Nebulas don't benefit HC races any more than any other race which does not cloak. Nobody is fighting carriers with cloakers other than Dark Wings, and they are immune. Now being a Priv player sucks in a nebula, but again they can rob ships elsewhere which sort of balances. Fascists generally fight in the open with poppers and Vickies, so they are not bothered much either.

@Gnerphk The reason I dislike the randomness is that if you are a victim early in a game to a bad storm, you are finished effectively. Not much chance to win, and you are now doomed to play 18 months for a middle pack finish at best. Sometimes it happens at the end where you have everything planned out for your winning move, and then a storm crushes your plan to dust and your neighbor invades behind it. Another 18 months wasted by random features. No skill required.

1128 days, 7 hours, 29 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Tough to argue. Though, truly, I think ion storms are fare more complex than that, and any overhaul of them should be a lot more in-depth.

WRT randomness: I've been hit by a massive meteor on my homeworld on Turn 3 -- as Birds in a Melee. Talk about painful.

1128 days, 7 hours, 27 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Lord Pollax, I totally agree regarding the ION storms. I never quit a game but I wonder if after being devastated by a HUGE extremely powerful storm that took over ten turns to pass through my area. Skill of lack of it made no difference.
I have also tried to play games with the stellar cartography features and I hate it.
To each his own, there are so many more and new gaming options.
I still love VGAP but I now just play a few classic games and put up with the 4 random storms.

1128 days, 7 hours, 24 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

"Nebulas don't benefit HC races any more than any other race which does not cloak."

There are only two races, those with HC, and those which cloak. And the crystals. >.<

"Nobody is fighting carriers with cloakers other than Dark Wings, and they are immune."

Except that for cloaking races to win a PP exchange vs HC races they have to tow kill, which is impossible in nebulae. Also you can't scout, can't lay hidden minefields...in short, you can't do *any* of the things you need to do as a cloaker to win. If you are going head to head vs the big carriers as a cloaker race you can't win. Nebulae get rid of your *only* advantage.

"Now being a Priv player sucks in a nebula, but again they can rob ships elsewhere which sort of balances."

No. The pirates are super weak *anyway*. Adding a mechanic *anywhere* that makes them impotent is just wrong.

"Fascists generally fight in the open with poppers and Vickies, so they are not bothered much either."

Yeah, these are the fascists *I* want to fight...the ones who don't scout, tow-kill, or lay surprise minefields.

1128 days, 6 hours, 42 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Furey Well, Feds don't cloak either. And speaking of cloaking races in a Nebula, the Birds are essentially immune to Nebulae (Resolute, DarkWing, and Red Wind Storm). That said, Privateers have access to the Red Wind Storm too.

1128 days, 1 hours, 43 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Furey You act like Nebulas are half the map. They are generally small, and usually impact just 1-2 races on any given map. Yes, they suck period for any Pirates. No they do not suck for Birds. And Fascists and everyone else cloaking will have to concede to no tow killing inside one.

Crystals, Feds and Horwasps to be precise... so 25% which do not cloak and do not have HC.

Pirates are "super weak" by design, and due to their racial abilities to steal your super strong ships. Impotence in a word: Loki

Your complaints about their inability to scout 10% of the map, or tow kill from inside it, is valid for the Fascists, but not as impactful since I believe they have other options available. Not so for the Pirates and other cloakers not called Birds.

1128 days, 1 hours, 3 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Sure, they are small, and sure, they only impact the non-bird cloakers. That is my point. They disadvantage the weakest races. It's a small area sure, but if you are one of the cloaking races looking for a fast kill vs your HC neighbour then you are out of luck. Conversely, if you start in one, your enemy can come into your home cluster with impunity. If they are to be a small, random element, they should not be so skewed to hurt cloakers. A recent game as the Borg I started in one. Two of my neighbours were pirate and fascist. Game over.

1128 days, 0 hours, 44 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

I agree with you Furey. A nebula should never be located over a HW of any race. Having experienced a Pirate game with a nebula over top of the HW, I know the pain a player can experience.

Imagine a star cluster in your core? Even worse.

I think we are both essentially saying the same thing... we need to limit the external random forces which interfere with the purity of the contest.

I grant that these are options that can be established by the host, and would not want them any other way. I suppose I'd prefer them to be off by default though.

1128 days, 0 hours, 17 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

I'm elated that so many skilled and wise commanders were able to see past the poor attempt at deadpan humor to thoughtfully discuss what I feel is a serious issue that can destroy months or even years of a players participation effort in a sector

With little knowledge of the game itself and no knowledge on how to suggest changes, how can the discussion be translated into proposals that action can be taken on?

1127 days, 21 hours, 38 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

How is here, what we're doing.

Joshua reads these threads sometimes, and if there's a solid suggestion he listens. Thus far we've discussed half a dozen potential flaws with starting position and random events; all we really need to do is formulate a proposal that encompasses what we've seen.

So, for example:
A-It would be a good thing if Massive Meteors wouldn't strike a homeworld for the first few turns of a game.
B-It would be nice if no Privateer starts in a Nebula (insofar as that's possible outside a melee).
C-Having any homeworld too near to a Star Cluster is a bad thing. It's either an insanely overpowered advantage or a deadly crippling blow.
D-Perhaps we should revamp Ion Storms completely. There's been objections to the terminology; there's that whole Sphere interaction we're seeing in a Champ game; cloudy storms never seem to merge... Oh, and storms appear and disappear randomly. You'd think we'd get a weather report in advance or something.

There's four different major concepts here. I'm sure people will be willing to weigh in; Planets players express their opinions pretty freely, I've found.

1127 days, 19 hours, 40 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

> how can the discussion be translated into proposals that action can be taken on?

Use the FEEDBACK button at the bottom of the page. Be sure to include a link to this thread in the description.

1127 days, 19 hours, 35 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Edward+Jellico: I see topics and opinions stated, and then enacted half a year later... but with no real evidence of correlation... so I'd suggest taking the proven route of either winning a Championship and/or starting a Uservoice suggestion.

http://planets.uservoice.com

1127 days, 19 hours, 2 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Good suggestion Glyn. I forgot about that option. More folks are starting to cast votes there, so it might be a viable method to enact some of these changes.

1126 days, 22 hours, 30 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

We're not getting much play with my approach; that's sure.

1126 days, 18 hours, 43 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Nah, we should call it the Heisenberg Dreadnought, blue in color of course, that takes over enemy ships by getting them addicted to Crystal meth.

1126 days, 17 hours, 31 minutes ago

captain storm

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Roflmao! Crystals get you addicted to "Crystal Meth", which of course they are immune to!

I can see the Feds coming after the Crystals to arrest them for "illegal drug trade"

Where is J Edgar Hoover when you need him?

1126 days, 14 hours, 55 minutes ago

ace rimmer

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

You know this may be the one time I wish Ninja Bunny was around to comment and have huge idea's about ships that may never come to pass. LOL

Finally a Ninja Bunny Thread worthy of his crazy ideas.

Ace

1126 days, 1 hours, 45 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

No worries Ace. I have been told I am the ghost of Ninjabunny coming back to haunt you. ;)

I am really here to discuss Ion Storms. Anything else is just rage, sarcasm, sadness and tears.

1126 days, 1 hours, 37 minutes ago

qinic

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Now Now, dry your tears, dust yourself of and put a feedback suggestion in.

Incidentally I mostly play Bots, Cyborg and Crystals so I see their advantage more than I saw them as hinderrense thus far. I have to agree they are a game changer.

So I would say they should be a feature that you can switch off and games with and without should be offered.

1126 days, 0 hours, 14 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

> they should be a feature that you can switch off and games with and without should be offered.

If you want a game with no Ion Storms, just create one. It's that easy.

1123 days, 16 hours, 51 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Whisperer

The issue is system generated games fill up much more quickly than if I were to host a game that would be described as "identical to the system games except no ion storms".

I don't have a pulse to peoples overall preferences to the existence of Ion Storms but if the do exist - can we at least evaluate how they behave? With the most important being, at least a turns warning before your entire fleet is enveloped by an ion storm and a webminefield in one shot.

1123 days, 1 hours, 54 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

On the other hand, ion storms do mimic real life. They mimic typhoons and Typhoon Cobra caused great damage to the Pacific fleet in 1944 near Luzon. In fact, this typhoon caused so much anxiety to the navy and US armed forces, that it was one of the reasons the atomic bomb was dropped on Japan. The navy needed for Japan to surrender or be invaded before the typhoon season started as they didn't want the fleet to be exposed. Nine years earlier, the Japanese fleet had similar destruction near China. You don't mess with typhoons and you don't mess with ion storms. Mother nature laughs at man's puny attempts to control her.

1123 days, 1 hours, 21 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

I would really have to disagree with the the analogy just because:

1 - It's a competitive game and not a simulation of real life.

2 - There is at least knowledge of a Typhoon season. How fun would it to be in the Navy if the the skies were blue, oceans were calm and 0 winds before lunchtime, and after lunch time your entire fleet is sunk? No warning, just gone.

Anycase, in between the sarcasm of the new crystal super ship I tried to articulate the proposal into an actionable uservoice suggestion that can be voted on.

https://planets.uservoice.com/forums/136520-general/suggestions/15813331-modify-behavior-of-ion-storms-to-limit-their-degre

1123 days, 1 hours, 8 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

At the minimum, I would think a weather report (or rather, Report) announcing each new or potential storm each turn would make sense. If a new storm is required, advance notice should be easy enough to generate.

And apart from programming effort, there's really no practical reason not to.

1123 days, 0 hours, 59 minutes ago

captain storm

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Furey:

"No. The pirates are super weak *anyway*. Adding a mechanic *anywhere* that makes them impotent is just wrong."

Actually, the pirates seem to win just as many games as any other race! So much for that theory!

So I agree the pirates don't need any more help!

Pirates just have to play differently. They don't have any good battleships, but can and need to rob some! If they are successful, look out!

1123 days, 0 hours, 51 minutes ago

gideon braver

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Perhaps some of you should try the Crystals out before saying ion storms make them powerful. Crystals are a very hard race to play, they can become powerful but you have to know how to use them. Ion storms can be a pain in the ass for the Crystals as well if they are strong enough. Ion storms are a random event and that can make them good or bad for you. Jellico a earthquake can strike anywhere at anytime and we have no warning system, games and life are not always meant to be completely fair. Luck has it's part to play.

1122 days, 17 hours, 46 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Gideon+Braver -- Greetings, Sub-Lieutenant. Good to have you with us.

I've played the Crystals a few times, mainly to learn their weaknesses. I take it your experience with them is from other sites than this?

1122 days, 17 hours, 15 minutes ago

mk4k

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Gideon+Braver I have a fair amount of experience of playing crystals. Ion storms are the crystals absolutly nr. 1 without question top best and most trustworthy Allied. As crystal, the first thing I always do in a turn before making tactical decisions, is to look for Ion storms. With Ion storms, my web can't be sweapt, and I have drained and taken over many enemy ships.

1122 days, 17 hours, 13 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Therein lies the question: How would ion storm reporting alter the present game balance?

1122 days, 16 hours, 52 minutes ago

gideon braver

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Gnerphk, I played the crystals back in the days when you uploaded your turns to a bbs. I have used them quite a bit and learned how to make them effective when most players ignored them and thought they were weak. Also thanks for the welcome. Mk4k I agree ion storms can be very helpful for the crystals, however we can not control them, we just take advantage of them if we can. I just think they are too random of a event to say it makes the Crystals over powered. Sometimes even the best laid plans get ruined by a surprise. The only think people fear from the Crystal player is web mines and perhaps our terraformers. No one is shaking in their boots from a Dimond Flame or Thunder Class Carrier, so we need web mines to be as effective as possible.

1122 days, 16 hours, 44 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Thought I detected some experience there -- certainly beyond your player record.

Agreed; the Crystal fleet is one of the worst in the game. On the other hand, they win a lot and rarely lose early. So do they really need quite so much of an edge?

1122 days, 16 hours, 32 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Crystal Players

If the Crystals are dependent on Ion Storms, we should treat 'Crystal Balance' as an independent variable from Ion Storms.

The binary nature of
1 - Crystals are "unbalanced" without ion storms
2 - Crystals can be handed victory on a silver platter given the right ion storm conditions.

just doesn't seem quite right to me.

I'm grateful that a high level crystal player like MK4K is willing to say "Yes I love ion storms. They can't sweep my mines. I play Crystals and I like it this way."

1122 days, 13 hours, 9 minutes ago

mk4k

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

And now that I am changing to focus on playing as the Federation, I still don't have any problems with Ion storms and the big benefit that the crystals have of them.

Before making tactical decisions I look for Ion-storms and take this into account.
If I am the crystals I try and attack with Ion-storms.
If I am fighting a crystal, and there is a risk to hit web, I lay still when a Ion-storm is passing, preferably on a planet, so I can " Land and Disassemble" the ship if low on fuel. If trapped in open Space I jettison fighters and torps.

Other tactics is when a Group of ships is together let the best ones have the fuel, so the crappy ones don't get drained.

You could lay mines, that the crystal player can't minesweap in a Ion-storm. (He can dump normal mines, and they will destroy my mines, but then he has fewer mines to lay as web.)

Of course there is the sudden appearance of a Ion-storm or the massiv and unpredictable Ion-storm. And I welcome these to keep the game open for randomness.

1122 days, 11 hours, 45 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

"No one is shaking in their boots from a Dimond Flame or Thunder Class Carrier"

The Emerald is the best all round cruiser class warship in this game. (I know it wasn't mentioned)
The CT kills every tech 10 torpship except DW/Anni/Nova, and performs well against bases.
The DF/CT combo is the best combination in the game. It kills most enemy HC *with* PP advantage; something many of the conventional "torp" races cannot.

People who lean entirely on webs as the crystals make for good vassals, but to win the game as the crystals, the enemy *should* be quaking in their boots at your DF/CT fleet; against a good commander you really can't count on captured ships to win the game for you. (SSD notwithstanding)

1122 days, 5 hours, 5 minutes ago

gideon braver

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

The Diamond Flame, Thunder Carrier is a great combo, dont get me wrong, but you have to be able to afford all those torps plus fighters. Thats the weakness for the Crystal player, you need some decent natives and a large amount of moly to really be able to excel on offense. The Emerald is a great mine layer but I find it to be on the weak side for offense, at least in my experience, unless you can get a attack in on a player very early in the game.

1122 days, 4 hours, 56 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

For sure, the crystals are a late game race, you nailed it there, but emeralds early game are surprisingly resilient and small webs deter incursion till post ship limit, when you can start filling some CT.

Since your DF will always die, you don't need more than 30 torps on them and they can have Tech 1 beams/engines and get towed into battle with the CT for offence, and have some with W7 engines for intercepting purposes. I tend to keep my heavy sweeping ships as emeralds, because the DF are shield fodder.

Crystals are obviously hugely dependant on good natives, but not really any more so than most non-lizard/non borg races.

I won a low native game as the crystals; as long as everyone else is suffering the same as you are, you just need the *same* natives as everyone else.

If the empire gets humanoid unity and you get all amorph, well....it doesn't matter who you are. :/

I'm really finding that, next to Ghipsoldal, Reptilian governments are awesome as Crystals, because of the massive Moly requirement you mentioned.

1122 days, 4 hours, 42 minutes ago

gideon braver

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

Oh I know most races depend heavily on good natives as well. That was also kind of my point as well, you stated it better tho. People dont always realize, getting tons of good natives and good minerals will always unbalance the game more than any ion storm or ship ever could. I think too often when someone dominates a game people forget that may have been the biggest factor. I am still learning a bit on here, and have found people on here are much more aggressive and quicker to attack then I was used to, so I am still updating my strategy to try to match that. Thanks for the input.

1122 days, 4 hours, 32 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@MK4K

Yes, you can't sweep someone else minefields in an Ion Storm as well. The difference is you can sit in a robot minefield for 10 turns and not have to turn over all your ships to them.

I'm no Vice Admiral and even this bear of very little brain can see the comparison is not even the same. Not even close. Not apples and oranges but like a sizzling porterhouse steak and tofuburger kind of difference here. :)

Everyone likes a little bit of randomness but, when is there too much random? Torps missing here and there. A smaller carrier beating a larger carrier. Would you want to invest 72 turns into a game, and have a chance where a cloaked ship lays a 150ly web minefield in the middle of your entire fleet and then have an ion storm cloak the entire thing? Not from poor planning on your part or the skill of the other players but from nothing but random chance because the warning for that ion storm was -zero-.

1122 days, 2 hours, 12 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

In fairness Ed, there was a lot of skill in that move. Getting a cloaking minelayer is not easy for the Crystals, and then getting one into position to screw someone's fleet is even harder. To time it with a storm? Pure genius.

1122 days, 1 hours, 54 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Lord+Pollax

Crystal laid a 150LY in the middle of 15 Darkwings with 150 Heavy Phasers.

They did not -time- it with the ion storm. Ion Storm appeared with no warning at all. That has been my point all along.

Every ship in the field is helpless. Reinforcements 100LY out is also helpless because they are hitting mines they cannot see or sweep.

Good chance I would have been screwed anyway but with one turn warning. I could of tried to move away from the storm, stack them, or disassemble them.

I had to reach out to several supreme commanders (sending screenshots) to figure out how I was hitting web mines up to 100LY out that couldn't be seen or swept.

Unfair and random much?

1121 days, 19 hours, 5 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Edward+Jellico: I've had an Ion Disturbance/Storm save me from an invasion, in fact resulting in capturing many ships, and totally change the games direction.

I've had an Ion Storm cancel my own invasion, which delayed resulted in the enemy starting the Diplomatic Victory countdown.

I've tried tried a dozen times to lay massive Webs right in front of an Ion Storm only to have it disappear and result in the Webs being easily Minesweeped away, aka 'waste of torps'.

____

The Selenite of course has made using Ion Disturbances/Storms to the Crystals advantage much easier.... In fact following an Ion D/S permanently is already something I hope to do with it.

1121 days, 18 hours, 54 minutes ago

edward jellico

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Glyn

Crystals shouldn't be playing VGA Ion Storms (or IonStorms.Nu) when the rest of us is playing planets. ;)

The reasons for the proposed change is not an anti crystal mechanism though in practice it could be seen that way.

If they need a rebalancing, perhaps Crystals should be given something else that they can depend on (ship or ship ability), and its something that others can depend on countering against.

1121 days, 18 hours, 10 minutes ago

RE: I have a new ship idea for the next Crystal Emperor. Let's...

@Edward+Jellico: It isn't like every single Sector you get a chance to use Ion D/S to your advantage... but there is nothing stopping other races cloaked ships or a Cyborog Fleet taking up residence in the path left by an Ion Storm... it effects all Races and thus the balance isn't straight forward... you cannot adjust the Crystals to 'fix' the balance.

An Ion Storm pushing ships travelling through Fascist space means no worries about Glory Devices waiting on every planet, gives you a chance to get at cloaked ships.

If I had my way I'd make it so ships can't launch fighters in deep space inside an Ion D/S.

Even if I wasn't a Crystal-only player, I'd still only play Classic Ion Storms Sectors, Ion Storms are fun for all! :p