I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

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254 days, 1 hours, 21 minutes ago

spacemanbiff

I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack of T-Rex Battleships. If I try to target the ship, I decloak and explode. Is there a way remove the Loki threat? I'm more than willing to sacrifice a ship or two to make it happen.

254 days, 1 hours, 12 minutes ago

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

Hm doesn't priority intercept (http://play.planets.nu/#/howtoplay/cloak-intercept) work?
It is even explicitly stated that Lokis are vulnerable to being intercepted by cloakers (http://play.planets.nu/#/howtoplay/abil-tachyon-device).
Of course, you first have to see the Loki to target it, which might be difficult if he is sitting on a planet - maybe some Fed or Birdmen can help you out on that, if your race is something else :) But as you say you "try to target" it, it sounds like you can target it.

254 days, 1 hours, 10 minutes ago

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

The only way you can do that, is via a 'Priority Intercept Attack' ; https://help.planets.nu/cloak-intercept

You have to sacrifice cloaking ships to take out a Loki.

If they have two Loki's, odds are one is out-of-fuel so you cannot attack it.

254 days, 0 hours, 52 minutes ago

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

Good point, might even be the Loki is out of fuel - it will not decloak anything, but if Spacemanbiff is priority intercepting a fuelless Loki, his ships are not cloaked anymore. They cannot fight the fuellless Loki, and then get busted by some angry T-Rexes.
So it is guessing then - if one guesses the Loki has fuel, intercept him with cloakers to destroy him. If one guesses he has no fuel, well then go in cloaked and tow him somewhere to his death (or at least forcing him to move out of the way if he tries to Tow-Break).
I am no expert, so maybe something is wrong with my thinking, but if everythings correct this is quite a dilemma.
Why did Tim decide in the first place that fuelless ships cannot be attacked... they should be easy prey. But hey, that's the ruleset, doesn't always make sense but tactics are adapted to it :)

254 days, 0 hours, 37 minutes ago

spacemanbiff

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

I should clarify. The Loki has fuel and is on the move with a stack of T-Rex ships. I am assuming it has fuel anyway. I expect to lose the intercepting/towing ship. My HOPE is to somehow move the Loki out of the stack and rob the incoming T-Rex ships. Am I out of my mind thinking I can do that?

254 days, 0 hours, 24 minutes ago

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

fuelless ships can launch EMPs that render all weapons targeting the ships to be eaily deflected.
Ships with fuel, cant use EMPs, as it will destroy the containment field of the neutronium, and cause a matter-antimatter explosion.
And no, you cant just launch an EMP in order to selfexplode.

254 days, 0 hours, 17 minutes ago

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

@Dines: Did you forget the '/s' ?
__

@Spacemanbiff: Should mention the Loki 'Tachyon Device' only functions if the ship has less than 20% damage. However if they know what they are doing, Loki is full of Supplies.

You cannot move the Loki out of the stack unless they failed to decloak you or failed to set their ships to fight you... Host Order is why; http://help.planets.nu/host-order-commentary

253 days, 23 hours, 46 minutes ago

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

Not sure what /s means. Warning, silly content ?
If gnerphk can explain the ship limit with unobtanium, i can make stuff up too..

253 days, 23 hours, 38 minutes ago

hiko

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

@SpacemanBiff, if you want to make sure you get him: intercept the Loki. One meteor could be enough to kill him. Both ships are so light, it is a game of chances. Two have better chances.
If you are afraid that he will be without fuel: move one more ship (with an id lower than the lowest id in his stack) into his group. In this case you can tow him away next turn. The id is important because tow happens in id order. It is a common tactic to avoid priv towing you.
Example: your meteor has id 100. His Trex has id 50, his Loki id 150. If you and the Trex will tow the Loki, the Trex will tow it because it has the lowest id and in the tow phase of the host he will be first, which means that he establishes a tow lock and moves away with both ships. When it comes to your Meteor, the spot you are in will be empty. Even though you have the stronger drives, there is no one there to tow.

If he is already in your cluster, you have to use more tricks to intercept. I would put a fuelles ship in a planetary orbit. When he takes the planet, you will be able to see him since your ship doesn't get killed. And then you can intercept as usual.

Always be aware of mine fields popping up. Meteors seem to have a gravitonic mine attractor :-)

P.S: I like calvin and hobbes, too

253 days, 23 hours, 35 minutes ago

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

So if the Loki is in free space accompanid by some big ships, and if it has fuel, it should be easy to snipe it out of the stack by doing intercepts with cloakers on the Loki. However, lizard player could see it coming and put the LOKI out of fuel and tow it with a T-Rex. And why not, if he does not move completely predictable you have very little chance to set up a robbing ambush in free space. And when he moves to any location of interest (aka a planet), he can just fuel up the LOKI, and let the Loki fly with a minimal escort to just some location within 10 LY of the planet. He will decloak all you cloakers at the planet, and the other ships going for the planet will bust them.
Again, I am no expert, maybe I am missing something, but I think you have without help from some allies no chance to rob and capture that fleet. Hey, would be a bit unfair if you could never ever attack a Pirate without getting robbed, stolen and turned your ships against you, wouldn't it? I would say best you can do is what villains do if a police smackdown is incoming on their place - they retreat and fight, ehrm rob, another day. Maybe you can bypass his fleet and cause havoc in his empire, enough to get an armistice. Or if he has a hostile neighbour, get there and help him to do a surpise invasion into Lizard territroy pulled by Gravitons. You are a Private, a villain, a do-no-good - so you have to be flexible and don't think you can destroy the spanish aramada in a fair fight (or capture it, for that matter).

253 days, 23 hours, 21 minutes ago

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

@Dines: My bad, '/s' is basically a flag you put at the end of a post/statement to indicate what you said was sarcastic.

253 days, 23 hours, 9 minutes ago

spacemanbiff

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

@Hiko If I'm going under the assumption that the Loki has fuel, will the ship ID number matter if I move into his cluster of ships?

253 days, 15 hours, 28 minutes ago

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

@Spacemanbiff: Short answer: no. Long answer: depends- if lizard ships don't attack you right away (remember, you are not cloaked) due to missing KILL and PE on all enemy ships and you interceptor also having not Lizard as PE, you could try to tow LOKI away next turn. Then for towing the Ship ID matters. But this is quite unlikely scenario.

253 days, 8 hours, 52 minutes ago

hiko

RE: I wish to target and remove/move a Lizard Loki in a stack...

if you intercept, the id should play no role *. The order of battle is mostly given by your friendly code. Only if your ships have identical or non-numeric fcs the battle order should depend on id.

* Going deep into the rules: a trick to avoid intercepts for your opponent would be to have his loki intercept one of his own ships. In this case your success would depend on id. Because the host phase "intercepting ships move" happens in order of id, too. So if your intercepting ship has a lower id than the loki, you would move to the lokis position, then the Loki would move to his intercepted ship and then... no combat would happen because you would be in a spot where no Loki is. To avoid this, you would need to intercept with a high id.
And of course, the Loki moving under his own power makes him vulnerable to mine fields you could place in his way.

In short:
low id: good for tow
high id: good for intercept

host order is a tricky science and some of it is counter intuitive. I have the complete host order formatted so it fits on a single page (double column) and have a print out on my desk. And even then I get surprised from time to time by clever use of it.

Btw, this is why the command ship campaign feature for the colonies is so valuable. It gives you an extra phase where you alone can do stuff. Besides the obvious mine sweeping and laying it makes you immune to tow. And creativity allows for more uses.