Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

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344 days, 2 hours, 58 minutes ago

admiral rex star

Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the second largest fleet in the game to your ally is a thing.

I don't even know how I feel about that, with 14 sector wins, I'm a little in shock this morning...

The position this player is in could be considered "extremely difficult" if not "hopeless"

In the end, I guess if you took the time to build it all (And he built a sweet fleet), it's yours to do with as you like. However...

Once again, when you get no REWARDS for anything other than winning, there is no incentive whatsoever to try and make a stand in a game you cannot win. Just burn it all, turn it all over, colonize it, whatever, and start a new game.

Does this happen if there is still gain to be made from a difficult position even though you can't win??

I guess we should be happy, I fear those ships in his hands more. But...

I would still advocate for being able to earn reward for finishing and placing higher in a game, even though you can't win.

-ARS

344 days, 1 hours, 45 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

I wish I had SOME idea what you were talking about.

344 days, 1 hours, 32 minutes ago

kelmain

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

Order of objectives:

1. Win the game
2. If not 1, Make the loss cost anyone who attacked you.

The degree to which I will pursue #2 varies based on how the in game interactions have gone. If it's been cordial opposition the goal will be pursued less aggressively. But at the end of the day if the only way to make it hurt is to give my fleet to someone who can hurt the opponent, that's what I'd do.

Why? Because everyone is vulnerable at points in any game and why not attack someone who will quietly sit back and be eliminated when they are vulnerable? But there are very good reasons tpo pick someone other than someone who will not go quiet into that good night...

It's conceivable that a fight could be so challenging and honorable that I'd surrender or hand over resources to an attacker at the point of tipping my king, but that would take a pretty epic conflict.

344 days, 1 hours, 10 minutes ago

nardol

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

I'll admit, I don't get it either. I play the game because I like to play the game, win or lose. Even in a "hopeless" position, I'll fight it out to the bitter end while doing everything I can to turn it around (gather new allies, weaken the opponent so other enemies will hit them, etc.) I can't imagine just burning it all down myself. It's not any incentive other than my own satisfaction that drives me, so the rewards are irrelevant to what I do in that regard.

344 days, 0 hours, 51 minutes ago

xi scorpii

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

What sector? Your Ceti Alpha 5 game?

343 days, 20 hours, 53 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

> earn reward for finishing and placing higher in a game

Which "reward" do you mean?

Achievement Points - These are ONLY earned at the end of the game, although they are temporarily awarded during the game.

http://planets.nu/#/howtoplay/leaderboard-details

Campaign Resources - You earn these when you take planets. You also earn additional Campaign Resources if you survive to the end of the game.

http://planets.nu/#/howtoplay/campaign-resources

Badges - Depending on the game, sometimes you get a badge for just finishing. In addition, the "turn" badges that are earned are kept, even if the player doesn't finish.

http://planets.nu/#/howtoplay/badges

Game Rank - This is the position within the field that you've achieved. This is ordered by planets controlled at the end of the game. If you do better in a game, you might get a better game rank.

343 days, 20 hours, 16 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

If I understand that correctly, I'm with you here ARS. I once lost a game because the Borg evaded all fights, lost nearly all his planets and then gave his whole fleet of Bios to Fed, dropping the game. I took a long break after this because I felt like being cheated by another player.

Nevertheless, I'm also a win or lose player. If I cannot win and get defeated (not in a close fight but definitely by a larger fleet), I just set my game to hibernate. Just clicking "end turn", waiting for the inevitable. Maybe setting taxes to 100%, colonizing ships to speed it up. I'd rather start a new game.

For me, it's not about points or rank. It's just not fun.

343 days, 19 hours, 48 minutes ago

admiral rex star

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

Which "reward" do you mean?

Survival points ! If you finish out a game from turn 1 to the end, I'm of the mind that Survival points and position finish points (after the winners ) should be worth trying to achieve. As it is now, how can you blame him.... wasting time on a spent position, when you could be starting something new makes little sense.

At the same time, there will be more points out there for NON-winners to achieve and unlock some cool campaign stuff with.

I was just shocked by it Rudel - I doubt this one impacts the game like your example, even though the game is far from over, but maybe... we'll see.

Either way, you adjust and move on - I certainly hold no ill will for the player nor am I trying to insinuate such. Perhaps a little disappointment, he is a very good player and I was looking forward to really getting mixed up with him..

Aye XI - Ceti Alpha 5 (74 --> 56 -18 ships 28 --> 41 +14 ships) and my cloakers can see the next group headed for turn over...

I understand those that worked hard to get all their Campaign Build Points under the old system may feel cheated if any new points are awarded that weren't available before but perhaps you could POST reward those finishes... DUNNO, I'm not a programmer.

I just really believe, if survival points are awarded, more players will effort to survive.

Just my worthless 2 cents..

-ARS

343 days, 19 hours, 37 minutes ago

kelmain

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

Let me clarify that denying resources or hurting an attacker by handing over ships is really only an option if you have already lost and exhausted your options for more direct retaliation. It's not something to consider as anything but a last resort.

343 days, 12 hours, 53 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

I've threatened to do it; it's an excellent brinksmanship option. And of course I'd certainly follow through.

343 days, 12 hours, 17 minutes ago

cptmartok

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

As the Federation Captain stood on the bridge of his ship, Impatiently waiting for there new allies to arrive. He had not slept in days. The war with the Borg had not been going well for either of the beleaguered forces meeting today he knew, and joining fleets and governments had yesterday seemed a laughable joke. Now it would be the only option to win this war. Who would have thought that abandoning Federation space would be the only way to save its people, He looked up at his view screen as his lieutenant warned of ships coming out of warp in the area.

Klingon ships started coming out of warp, "Looks like this is for real boys", he said. an er of trepidation in his voice, "Lets see if these Klingons really have this new weapon".

343 days, 11 hours, 25 minutes ago

admiral rex star

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

If this is the CPT Martok I think it is, I stand at the ready, because the CPT Martok I know is one resourceful warrior and he ALWAYS seems to thrive. I have no doubt he will find a way to do so again.

Like kissing razor blades that one.

343 days, 2 hours, 2 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

Rewards do not encourage 'fighting-to-the-end' unless carefully crafted to do so.

I think the multipliers for Diplomatic Victory would have to go for that to be true here. If you want to discourage leaving games that the player could last to the end... consider that huge difference in reward results in a win-it or leave-it mentality if you are focused on the rewards.

I'd prefer just an ELO ladder and no unlocking Campaign-goodies at all, so not much else to say.
__

Gifting fleets happens for three reasons I can think of:

1. Transferring ships to an alternate account
2. Out of spite to hurt another players chances to win
3. To reward an ally

I only take issue with 1.

343 days, 1 hours, 28 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

I agree that the deeds players do to quickly exit a game are unsavory. I for one though believe that only discipline works to discourage, not rewards.

Remove a game playable from a player for each drop/resign till they can only play one and must finish it alive in order to regain a new playable game slot.

This may be draconian, but it would likely be the only thing to finally curb the problem. That and blocking new player accounts from playing in more than one non-midshipman game till they finish a game alive.

I'm not saying a natural death in a game is bad, but you should not be rewarded for it either. Death would not drop you a game, but does not count as an eligible finish to gain any either.

Premium could allow additional game slots, but should probably be subject to the same rules for consistency. Should improve game quality considerably by preventing all the drops/resigns.

343 days, 1 hours, 8 minutes ago

admiral rex star

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

Man, do I respectfully disagree with you both. I have friends who have spent countless hours/days/years trying to unlock all the Civilization Achievements, because the rewards are there. There is no real game bonus for having them. Here, there is a game bonus attached in campaign Coolio's. (Is that even a word)

Punishment has never been more productive than incentives. It is one of the reasons slavery faded, it's production was less than that of the current methods. (I shouldn't of opened that bottle but whatever)

Reward systems do work and statuses achieved do matter to people.

Again, my worthless two cents...

343 days, 0 hours, 45 minutes ago

cptmartok

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

@Glyn

Gifting fleets happens for three reasons I can think of:

1. Transferring ships to an alternate account
2. Out of spite to hurt another players chances to win
3. To reward an ally

I Have on several occasions Given over majority of my fleet if my ally has better specs with them, Such as there are races who have extra fighter bays when they fight, depending who i am i may hand them my carriers if the fight goes poorly, Or I may hand over torpedo ships to a crystal. Possibly even hand Cubes to a Fed, or any ship to a Borg for self repair,

What im saying is that, I can think of a bunch of strategic reasons to give over your fleet, burning the worlds Down less so, after all those worlds could have used what ships are left to funnel there remaining resources to the owner of there new fleet, or better star docked up and tried to hold the enemy awhile longer,

Im all for roleplay to be honest, if i am a privateer, Klingon, Borg, I try to play in that mindset, the shifty pragmatic privateer, The cocky Federation Captain, the savage Horwasp, Great add to the game by the way, I do my best not to think in points,

League Of Free Worlds Captain Martok
Star Paladin !st Order

342 days, 23 hours, 54 minutes ago

qanar jinn

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

He has a point. A Fed RedWind after all, is a five fighter bay, 60 cargo ship, that cloaks for free

342 days, 20 hours, 35 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

"Man, do I respectfully disagree with you both. I have friends who have spent countless hours/days/years trying to unlock all the Civilization Achievements, simply because they are there."

I'm at 60% with 1500h played. Civ 5 was just perfect. ;)

342 days, 19 hours, 39 minutes ago

admiral rex star

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

Even though Civ 6 is out, I'm stuck on Civ 5 ! I'm in love with the Shoshone … Call your ruins and those Apache Warriors, upgrade into the best Tanks in the game!

You got me on the achievements...I'm 47%

342 days, 18 hours, 17 minutes ago

xi scorpii

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

Thanks guys, you're killing me. Now I've got to go out and buy Civ 5. Are you playing with the expansions? I've heard they brought back some of Civ 4 qualities and made the game better.

342 days, 16 hours, 16 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

I agree that for many people the achievements and status symbols do work, but those folks are not the problem that is trying to be solved. It is the droppers, resigners, and folks that join games to ruin the enjoyment of the rest (ala King Wog) that need fixing. I firmly believe these are the types of folks that only punishments work for. It has two possible outcomes: they quit or they stop the bad behavior. Win/win for all.

As far a s I know, most actually pay to play here or do so willingly. Not sure how we got to tie slavery into this conversation, but I'll skip commenting further as it was likely a faux pas.

I don't think the game (or any game) should give out participation awards. There are winners, and a whole bunch of losers. Considering the odds and the talented players drawn to this game, losing is the expected outcome for most and statistically likely for all. A "Yay You Finished 8th Award" seems pointless and unlikely to curb many droppers.

Sid Meier's Civ games are indeed top notch. Much like VGAP, it has stood the test of time well (albeit far more popular).

342 days, 10 hours, 55 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

@Cptmartok: The scenario I was addressing was specifically about players leaving the game AND gifting their fleet away at that point. As is the original thread topic.

Your essentially talking about ship trading, not gifting.

342 days, 10 hours, 39 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

"ARS: I have friends who have spent countless hours/days/years trying to unlock all the Civilization Achievements, simply because they are there."

@ARS: People waste their energy on many things... that doesn't really reflect on anything but the 'utility', aka "pleasure" they derive from it, not the merit of the activity or the advantage of alternate activities.

But I've spent time running along every wall in Wolfenstein3D... so the 'time sinks' can come in many forms.

342 days, 10 hours, 8 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

Since we're digressing, I'd like to mention a story I just read about a secret quest hidden in the most recent World of Warcraft expansion.

Apparently, someone who had completed a hidden secret task later stumbled on a pebble that could be moved, and that would generate an oddly meaningless cryptic message. Eventually, an anagram solution was found, but it didn't lead anywhere in particular. Until someone else found another pebble in a truly obscure area and connected the dots. After that, a vast segment of the internet began devoting hundreds of hours to an exhaustive search, which led through twenty non-quest objectives, half a dozen onerous yet meaningless tasks, and a couple of laborious obstacles (including clicking on a single item 144 times in a regularly timed sequence).

After all this (which reportedly takes forty straight hours to run once you've met the initial requirements) you can gain access to a special belt transmog shaped like a clock. It's named... the "Waist of Time".

In case you think I'm just yanking your chain with a hairy dog story, here's a link:
https://www.wowhead.com/guides/waist-of-time-secret-belt-transmog

(I think the moral of this tale is: "Don't play WoW; play Planets." But I could be biased.)

342 days, 9 hours, 29 minutes ago

RE: Wow - Burn all your planets to the ground and give away the...

@Xi Scorpii you definitely want Civ 5 Complete. In a Sale you can get it for 5-6 € / $. Especially BNW brought a lot of quality to the game, don't play without it. I never got into VI. I loved I, II, IV and V but VI... it's just not my game. Too tedious, too much meaningless micro, not the same magic. Also strange comic graphic to make it fit on the Switch and mobile devices. Just stay with IV or V.

@Gnerphk I was genuinely surprised by that WoW egghunt. Most of the game now is streamlined and tailored to the masses (like other AAA games). I'm waiting for the vanilla client, although I'm sure Blizzard will find a way too mess it up by including "quality of life" "improvements".