Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

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246 days, 20 hours, 7 minutes ago

stormfirekiller

Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Cheating in games

I have a couple of cheaters in my current game. Is there a blaklisting about players who cheat and is there any consequences about cheating?

246 days, 20 hours, 6 minutes ago

sirad

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

what kind of ?

246 days, 20 hours, 4 minutes ago

stormfirekiller

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Its a one ally game. Turns out that there has been 3 way alliance all the time.

246 days, 20 hours, 0 minutes ago

sirad

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Thats usual. I encountered this here too.

Who cares for honor if its so easy to farm a 'Rank' ?

246 days, 19 hours, 40 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

One ally rule only considers the number of players who can share the 'metagame' victory (being named as winner, higher scores etc). It does not state you can't have whatever diplomatic relations with however many players you want, you just might be limited in setting safe passages or intel shares.

It is pretty normal that players support their favorite winning player. Also there are pregame alliances sometimes, which suck, however they are not explicitly against the rules and are generally frowned upon.

Now if one of the players is there purely to feed other players? Then it could be actual cheating. Take a look at the player histories to see if you find anything dodgy there.

246 days, 19 hours, 20 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

The only public game is a Max Allies 1.

This means that two players can "win" the game together and gain extra awards.

As in they declare an alliance and share a win if they both get to 50% of the planets together instead of a 40% solo win.

This does not mean that you are forced to only have diplomacy with one player. You can only trade ships with one player. You have to fight everyone else apart from this one player.

So slapping a cheating label on someone and asking for black list I think is a little harsh.

There are no site rules stating players cannot assist each other.

There are only site rules stating if they are the same account.

Do you have proof they are the same account?

Yes its unfair that people agree to join games together as secret teams.

But again do you know they arranged to join together?

Or did they form an agreement after early diplomacy after reaching a common goal?

If a player has played many games together then it becomes unfair.

We do not have access to Admins information so cannot access information they have.

Instead of branding the cheaters why not just use the information you have and give it to the other players and arrange to beat them by working together?

But then you will be using diplomacy and not keeping to the 1 ally rule so you could be forming your own team of three and they could brand you a cheater?

246 days, 18 hours, 23 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Im afraid you have misunderstood the rules of the game.
I guess it is pretty easy to think that max 1 ally means you can only cooperate with one player, but that is not the case.
But you are not the only one. I have been accused of colluding, because i cooperated with another player in a 0 ally game.
I think it would be a good idea to update the docs, to tell everybody what max allies actually means.

I also think that it would be a good idea to update the rules, stating that joining a non-team game as a team is cheating. The problem is just that it is very hard to proove such cheating. But it would still help a little i think.

I took a look at your game, using whisperers tool:
http://planets.nu/_library/whisperer-scripts/researchgame.html
It does not look like the players mentioned have played together in other games..

Your game will be over soon.
I have seen other players, when starting a new game, asking everybody to promise that they do not join the game pre-allied.
I guess people can deny to answer, or just lie, but it should get rid of the pre-game alliances that are formed because people didnt think it was problem.

246 days, 18 hours, 11 minutes ago

stormfirekiller

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

I dont think pregame ally is cheating if everyone sees that. In my game liz-col were allied from start, but they were losing to our alliance. Last trn col gave most of his virgos to liz and this trn liz formed a new alliance with fasc and now they met winning condition. Liz-fasc also cooperated during the game.

The point is that one ally requirement doesnt have any meaning since its constantly violated. These games are actually for as many alliances as you like.

246 days, 18 hours, 0 minutes ago

sirad

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

That tool is quite useful, but it does not display everything.

Look at those two players as an Example.

Sven2356
Sonea

(played Fed and Crystal in one of my games, i took over one race as replacement)

They are explicitely one Person. They Joined together and dropped due to missed Turns together.
In The Game im actually playing in, clearly visible that Sonea is the socketpuppet of Sven2356

But the research doesnt bring up sonea if i search after Sven2356. Something is missing in that tool.
(and thats not the only game they joined and dropped together due missed turns)

How many Cheaters are amongst us ?

246 days, 17 hours, 42 minutes ago

marceline

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

If I join a game and then when it starts I notice another player I've worked with before, would it be a "preformed alliance" if I asked them to work together with me at the first opportunity and they agreed? Also would I have to declare this to other players as soon as it happened?

246 days, 17 hours, 35 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

There are only three rules:
http://help.planets.nu/rules

There is an honour system called Lone-Wolf that restricts diplomacy... but otherwise anything goes.

246 days, 17 hours, 13 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Stormfirekiller that is only for the win requirements. Only two can share the win requirements. If one person changes their mind they can. As in real wars. Nations change sides to end the war.

As Glyn says in site games there are only the three rules.

But there are custom games that ask you to obey game rules.

246 days, 17 hours, 6 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@sirad
The problem with whisperers tool is that it doesnt track players that have dropped out.
But, if they never show up in the tool, it is because they never complete games, yet alone win them.
So at least we wont see them in any higher ranking games.

Your example is extreme. They join games within minutes, and drop at the same time. In the few games i looked at, they actually publically allied in turn 1 or 2. I guess that makes a little bit fairer,
but it wont solve the problem with another new player getting caught in an unfair sandwich between 2 preallied players.

If i had to put money on it, i would also bet that this is one person, so poor at playing the game, that he decided to control 2 races, but stil fails.

But am i so sure that it is one person, that i would kick him of the server ?
Innocent until prooven guilty.
Could it be 2 brothers playing on the same computer ? (so IP tracking wouldnt help)
There is no rules saying you cant join pre allied, so what rules have they broken ?

they do appear to be inactive now, so now he/they is/are just an example.

246 days, 16 hours, 37 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Think of planets.nu like the original reality series survivor or big brother, but obviously not as popular.

246 days, 16 hours, 34 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

> The problem with whisperers tool is that it doesnt track players that have dropped out.

It doesn't see the players who have dropped from the game you wish to research, but, for the common games list, it looks at the players' history. Because of this, it sees games where the player was joined for a Host run.

I'll be working on this in the future, even catching most of the partial turn players, but that's a rather large undertaking that I don't have time for right now.

> Look at those two players as an Example.

If there are specific players that you wish to research, research them instead of a game.

246 days, 16 hours, 30 minutes ago

stormfirekiller

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

One thing to add too: fasc-liz are not winning. I have loads of fedautomas+golems and Novas rolling on them, towed by MBRs. Its just in these few trns they can achieve planet control and victory before our alliance takes over and crushes them.

246 days, 16 hours, 21 minutes ago

sirad

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@whisperer:

'If there are specific players that you wish to research, research them instead of a game.'

Well i first searched them out without the tool because i was suspicious about the state of the race i took over and researched them both and their games out by hand.

Overwhelming evidence.

Nevertheless, that tool is useful and great because it tracks most stuff and gives hints about those obvious multibuddys.

246 days, 16 hours, 15 minutes ago

capwell

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Stormfirekiller
So you are against the "wrong" unions ... But in the last letter you wrote that you yourself have such a union ?! Fed + Robot + Priv ??? Explain yourself!

246 days, 16 hours, 13 minutes ago

stormfirekiller

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

I captured a MBR before killing privs and then cloned the shit out of it

246 days, 15 hours, 46 minutes ago

sirad

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@dines: 'Your example is extreme.'

Well i think the proof is clear.
People can cheat the hell out here and get away with it. If noone searches noone gets found out.

Luckily those who needs to cheat to get forward are not smart enough to cover their traces... :-)

246 days, 15 hours, 27 minutes ago

aelfgar

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Maybe it would be useful to be able to flag a player as suspicious. I expect the admins have already considered this and decided against it.

This is a very contentious game. People take it hard when they lose after months of careful game play. My suspicion is that it's mostly new players who think someone has cheated.

Perhaps what could be done is to have a flagging system available after a certain number of games have been completed? (Note that I say, "completed," not played.)

How many games completed? I don't know, honestly. And I wouldn't count the usual MvM game or solo (levels) games. Only public games.

This, of course, leaves the question of, "Should this flagging system be visible to players or only admins?"

I would say that, at least initially, it should only be visible to the admins.

246 days, 15 hours, 13 minutes ago

stormfirekiller

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

I played this game already 1995 so I dont think Im new player. This platform and its rules are new to me though.

246 days, 15 hours, 5 minutes ago

littlepuppi

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

I am in the same game and on the wrong end of this behaviour... To be frank I dont really care what the "rules" are.. It totally stinks and will put people off... You find out you literally put hours and hours into it, fighting to stay alive spending hours working together then you find out its just a total pre arranged fix... Someone should do something about it as I have just come back to the game and I think this totally sucks.

I have just posted to the wider players in the game saying hope the victory feels great.. Win at all costs, whats the point... This is not a game its just a facade... The players that do this should have their IP 's black listed IMO.

Stormfirekiller is a great guy and people should be grateful he has come back as he is a great player, but what is the point when people pre arrange games?

246 days, 15 hours, 1 minutes ago

littlepuppi

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Dines - thanks for doing that - makes sense.. They are cheating toe rags.. there have been really weird occurances in the game where it feels like everyone is attacking us for "no reason"...

WHat can be done about these toe rags, as simply, they ruin the game...

246 days, 14 hours, 52 minutes ago

littlepuppi

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

May as well call them out as the cheaters they are...

thommy35, gigaschatten, apis toll, tkarrade

This is not good for the game.. Someone should get a grip of this behaviour... Only been back myself 6 months and not finished a game yet, this is a right kick in the teeth to be dealing with this...

246 days, 14 hours, 30 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

I've been investigating people that participate in these threads for years now.

A cheater is obviously going to attack these threads. Over and over that has been the case. Until Whisperer was busted using his secret alternate account Happy Daze, I had not been exposing Rule 2 violators publicly that were posting in threads discouraging the reporting/discussion of Rule 2 violations.

Instead I just added them to my list,... then I see if they last years or not. So far the vast majority of these Rule 2 violators go away on their own... often all the accounts dropping at the same time giving me strong assurance my suspicions were correct.

The novelty has worn off... tired of expending effort to expose these people, especially when long term they tend to go away on their own... but since we have so many beginners here... maybe the cheaters need to know that long term they cannot get away with this. Well not without going to the lengths Whisperer demonstrated, for example creating an alter-ego that makes posts that sound nothing like your other account.

___

@Capwell: Why did you have to post?

=P

Look I hate finding things that require further investigation... I don't have time for this crap.

You play with Lumberjack a lot... aka high Player Affinity... that alone warrants investigation.

But I'm tired... just tell me what to think.

246 days, 14 hours, 29 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@littlepuppi
im not quite sure what you are thanking me for.
I am talking about 2 players who are not in your game.
I also looked at your game, and i see no sign of those players working together in other games.
The only violation here is you calling them cheaters.
gigaschatten even answered to your accusations, and denied them ?

246 days, 14 hours, 26 minutes ago

littlepuppi

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Fair enought but the evidence is compelling.. Ally to one player.. get everyone attacking (probably the only 2 legit players in the game) Then suddenly drop that alliance, ally to another player to give 250 planets and start game end countdown... What a great game that makes for... So much fun..

246 days, 14 hours, 24 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Littlepuppi and your proof is?

Let the game end then start digging through the game for proof for you four player secret team.

And make it a serious search and not find your only evidence in that past few turns.

Remember WWII. Russia was on the side of Germany in the early days. But was then attacked by Germany so switched sided and "joined" the Allies for the "team" win.

As a reminder this is a war game.

When you get further into your games you will realise yes there are some people who are secret teams with pre arranged alliances.

But mostly will be that is someone wants to win. And they don't have a history of race X hates race Y. They have no history with anyone in the game. They don't have thousands of years of pre history. And if they want to switch sides for multiple reasons they can do.

They decide if X and Y join they both can win so will drop their ally to do so.

And I recon that is more reason to black list them as they appear to value winning on any grounds over earlier diplomacy.

So before you accuse and blacklist four players try and get evidence first.

Things change and without seeing the game from all sides you do not know.

So black list when the game is over and you can link the evidence. Go through the game and see who gained advantaged from it from early on.

And even after all of that they have broken no site rules.

246 days, 14 hours, 23 minutes ago

mursu

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

To be honest I cannot see anything in this thread to prove there is actual cheating in the game OP is playing. The fact that game setting is "max allies = 1" really doesn't mean more people couldn't be co-operating. Actually that's what is needed to win a lot of the time. Of course only two players really win, but some might be happy to survive or see some player win because of some happenings in the game.

So this game is a lot about diplomacy too. Just take a look at the Championship matches and see how much co-operation for example Emork has done. And Championship games are 0 ally games!

After the game is finished, everyone can review what has happened. Possible cheating is then much more easier to spot. It could also be possible to spot if some players have made pre-game agreements. That is not technically cheating, but sure against "unwritten rules" of this site. But again, I don't think there's such evidence available right now so I strongly recommend not to call anyone in the game a cheater.

246 days, 14 hours, 8 minutes ago

littlepuppi

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Well I dont understand why you would ally to a player who is alive and kicking and then suddenly ditch that alliance and ally to the player who has the most planets to start the game over counter when all is to play for... Unless its a fix... During all of these events, not a single combat takes place between these players that we could see.... But maybe this is just how the game is "played" or not... All I look for is fair chance... I had no idea this sort of thing went on TBH, its clear something is going on in this game, maybe we wont find out, but its not fun to be part of.... Totally pointless game in the end...

246 days, 13 hours, 57 minutes ago

stormfirekiller

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

I think admins should take this seriously. This kind on actions only deters new players to play this game. The loss of income..

246 days, 13 hours, 55 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Sometimes real life gets in the way.
Maybe the colonial player got a new job, or a baby, or a new girlfriend.....
If that hapened to me, i would also say, sorry guys, i have new priorities now, i wont have time to play properly, take half my fleet, and degrade me to third partner in the cooperation....

I do understand your frustration, if you have been playing under the assumption that only 2 races can cooperate.
But dont blame other players for unclear rules, blame the site...

And as others have said, wait for the game to finish...

246 days, 13 hours, 55 minutes ago

aelfgar

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Calling someone a cheater is about the most severe accusation you can make here. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

This entire thread is really an argument that there should be a flagging system restricted to accounts that have completed some number of public games. I'd say it ought to be at least ten and probably more. Ten games is a lot of time, but even that could be, "gamed." You could join a game and simply not do much. That would get you destroyed pretty quickly and you would have, strictly speaking, "completed," the game. Obviously, some people would play be the rules, so to speak. Maybe admin review should be a part of being able to flag players as suspicious? Of course, that could lead to claims of personal bias.

Cheating happens. In every game that exists. Some people just aren't satisfied with having the possibility of winning. One thing is certain, there are going to be cheaters and they are going to put a shocking amount of effort into corrupting any system to prevent them from cheating. Which is why no game has ever entirely eliminated cheaters. Don't get too bent out of shape over it. Just don't play with those people any more. Make a list. Check it. If someone on your list shows up in a game you are in drop out and explain why. That is about all you can do. No automatic system is going to be able to control every cheater. There are already systems in the game to prevent a lot of kinds of cheating.

Keep in mind, what you consider cheating may not really BE cheating. Not according to the rules of the game. It's war. You should try to really take the expression, "All's fair in love and war," seriously. Read some strategy guides. What you are calling 'cheating' is pretty close to what you can find in some of them: secret alliances isn't cheating. It's not nice, but is war really nice? That's the point of the game! And even so, there are a lot of things players won't do because it's not just one war and people will refuse to play with you if you do things that, in a real war, you absolutely would not hesitate to do! In a real war, where your life is at stake, would you really stop to think if your strategy is, "fair," to your opponent? Of course not! Here, though, you have a reputation to consider and so questions of what is 'fair' to the other players are going to matter. Because people keep lists of other players that they will not ever knowingly join a game with.

246 days, 13 hours, 48 minutes ago

aelfgar

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Littlepuppi:
"Well I dont understand why you would ally to a player who is alive and kicking and then suddenly ditch that alliance and ally to the player who has the most planets..."
Because you see a quick win in that strategy and you want to win? Because you agreed, at some point (not necessarily even before the game began), to try to let that player accumulate planets and to try to steer combat away from them as much as possible so that you could ally with them later on and have an easy win?
There are only about a million reasons for that to happen that have nothing to do with actual cheating.

@Dines: I don't think the rules of the site are even slightly unclear. That's why there are only three of them. It prevents, "rules lawyering." Which kills games faster than anything I can think of.

246 days, 13 hours, 46 minutes ago

littlepuppi

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

This is a digital war though, not real life, and based on what I have seen in this game, you can basically setup a win right from the start, normal players are just being manipulated then someone gets a win that you never had a chance of stopping.. Thats not a "game"..... Thats a coronation...

And for the record I have never ever gone back on my word in a VGA planets game as I like to think I am a truthful player.... Clearly we will "never" know all the facts, but after playing a game for all this time the ending of it is deeply unsatisfactory and does not encourage a long term commitment to play....

What some seem to be saying here is basically, get in the sewers and you will have a chance.... Maybe that is the case, but for me that would just be a hollow victory and not one I would ever be proud of..

246 days, 13 hours, 41 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Jeez; I don't recall ever needing to cheat to win. And I've got a decent record.

Granted, there's that one game where I was playing against a couple former Emperors and a couple more former Supreme Commanders... That one still causes me the odd shaky moment.

My secret's a simple one: I work hard to play every turn, to put eyes on every planet and ship at least every couple turns, to communicate with all my neighbors, to be kind when I can, and to be quite ruthless when I must.

246 days, 13 hours, 33 minutes ago

aelfgar

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

I've read your strategy guildes, @Gnerphk! (And they're excellent!)

Maybe the people concerned about 'cheating' that might not actually be a violation of the site rules ought to read them?

@Littlepuppi:
No, you can TRY to set up a win right from the start. Even if you DO have a secret alliance with some other player it isn't a guarantee of a win. It's something you have to think about when you are deciding who you are going to fight, isn't it? "Is this person in an alliance they aren't talking about openly?" It's part of the game.

What did you THINK all of these really experienced players were talking about when they said that 'diplomacy' is a huge part of this game? This isn't a first person shooter game, you know...

246 days, 13 hours, 26 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Well looking at the game in question it looks to have been one player out performing three teams of two.

In this game certain players think you can only work as a team of two and can not receive help from anyone else.

They had reached 166 planets and looked to be reaching a difficult time with the next team of two was on 114 planets.

So the single player decides they need to reach 200 planets which may be a long haul and drag the game out. Especially as everyone else realises they need 40 planets to win and they may all turn on you so making it even harder.

OR you can approach the next highest player. If they agree you hit the 250 limit and start the count down.

Other player may or may not have discussed it with his other ally and drops the team to ally with the winner and get a easy win.

Why was this prearranged?

Who knows, you will have to look into it after the game ends.

This looks like a player using diplomacy to end a game quicker.

One player knows he needs help to win.

One player knows they cannot win in his current position unless he accepts the offer.

246 days, 13 hours, 19 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Aelfgar: Except violating Rule 2 is not an extraordinary event... we aren't talking about the existence of God here.

Also extraordinary proof for cheating? That doesn't mean 'conclusive' or 'a lot' of evidence, it means a *#&@ing unicorn walks through the room and states he is a cheater!

:D
_ _ _

Might water down the power of saying "extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof" when you used for things like this... a bit like how 'Nazi' has lost all it power due to overuse by idiots.
___

Since we drug test Special Olympics athletes, I see no problem doing the same here... the problem is there is no test... not even the Admins can know for certain.

We don't require extraordinary proof to put people in jail... we drug test Special Olympics athletes (and yes some are caught!)... I see no point in self-censorship besides cultivating a reputation of being fair and correct.

So yeah, we shouldn't accuse people of violating Rule 2, we should say we suspect they are... if someone freaks out just because you are suspicious... that means they think freaking out makes them look innocent... which honestly is even worse than cheating. Your feelings are your own problem, keep them to yourself.
___

I figured out Happy Daze was an account of Whisperer's based off how he wrote posts despite his efforts to conceal that fact by pretending Happy Daze was a black drug user... how do I prove two people sound the same even when they on the surface do not, to someone besides myself?

Honestly, if Whisperer had not admitted Happy Daze was his account, no matter what I said I doubt anyone would have believed me without the evidence I had gathered which is totally reasonable... that is why I gathered it. But he admitted to it because he didn't want people to see how I figured it out. I regret not posting the information and accusation at the same time. Immediately after exposing this Happy Daze account he made more and started harassing me with them, but this time he wasn't going to make the same mistakes that allowed them to be exposed.

So all I did was make a known cheater better at hiding his cheating.

That is the most frustrating part of all this... there is no solution... you just have to be careful who you end up in a Sector with.

246 days, 12 hours, 24 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Sirad: I tried that tool on them... yeah it misses the APP Sectors, as well as a team game... possibly on purpose. And the Sector they dropped; http://play.planets.nu/#/sector/217004/events

I see they did a Turn 1 Full Alliance... join minutes within one another.

It could be two RL friends.

What it looks like to me... is two people met in the APP games and then joined a game together.

Sven2356 has an online presence (yes I cyberstalk), that is a real person and account.

But the exact same Turn dropping... that is bad. However multiple Turn 1 Full Alliance... joining at the same time... that screams two players communicating they know each other. Also explains why a "cheater" would play the APP.

So maybe they both lost interest in the game at the same time.

They are gone it appears, so it was easy to discuss openly, but I'd label this as Player Affinity only... not even bother reporting to Admins, especially since they are in no games currently.

246 days, 12 hours, 7 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Another thing to look for... is accounts that farm good positions.

Basically a bunch of disposable accounts join a Sector... play for a bit... Resign (or fake dropping)... then the real account takes over the position and puts in 50 Turns to get all the credit.

If you have a Resign or drop from a game, and no one advertised it, but suddenly someone snaps it up? Be suspicious... except if it is one of the following accounts which mostly just take replacement positions.

http://play.planets.nu/#/account/kymm/history
http://play.planets.nu/#/account/ac/history
http://play.planets.nu/#/account/xmas%20eve/history
http://play.planets.nu/#/account/king%20wog/history

I'm pretty sure these four are the same person also... last time I pointed this out Whisperer lost his mind demanding I retract this claim.

They might be his... there is no Rule against doing this... cannot think of another reason this triggered him so.

246 days, 8 hours, 55 minutes ago

sirad

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

'So maybe they both lost interest in the game at the same time.'

Maybe they are Michail Gorbatschov and Vladimir Putin, pretending to be other people and they dropped all their games at once while bein off for hunting in Siberia ?

Hmmmm...

No.

246 days, 8 hours, 15 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Glyn,

> if Whisperer had not admitted Happy Daze was his account

> So all I did was make a known cheater better at hiding his cheating.

So I'm a cheater now? Prove it with something besides your hate and jealousy.

Thanks for the lies, but we're tired of them.

246 days, 7 hours, 28 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Whisperer: I've never called you a cheater till now? This is the first you've ever heard of this? Are you *#&@ing shitting me?

But seriously, what do you think I know about you... in order to be jealous?

I might be jealous... this lack of information thingy kinda prevents that.

246 days, 7 hours, 18 minutes ago

blue_bird

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@ Glyn and Whisperer
I'm a new player from Brisbane, Australia. So I really have no right to weigh in here. But I am old and have some experience with frustration.

I really do enjoy this game. It's fun, strategic and brings together many of the sci-fi shows I love. Lets treat each other or learn to treat each other with respect and dignity. In the end it's what really counts.

246 days, 7 hours, 15 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Sirad: Using Occam's Razor I'm right there with you... however I feel obligated to finish investigating before deciding. Really I just wanted to see if the tool failed like you stated, which unfortunately it does.

246 days, 6 hours, 48 minutes ago

sirad

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

I will myself restrict from posting into this partially derailed feed any further with the well known phrase:

'There is Another Settlement that needs my Help'

246 days, 4 hours, 21 minutes ago

mursu

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

I have to admit I admire the creativity how some manage derail any thread. Here a new player has a problem so why couldn't we focus on that one? I'm sad to see attempts to ruin this otherwise very welcoming community.

So yes, there are cheaters in every game. However, in Planets those are actually very few. For example I haven't encountered a single one in my games. As you gain ranks and get into higher and higher level games, the chances to encounter cheaters go down even further. And of course the fact is that once you learn the game properly, you will win beginner level games even if there's someone cheating because generally cheaters do not have the skill and patience to play this game properly.

But as mentioned, this game is much about diplomacy. You will need to forge deals with friends and potential future enemies (or alternatively if you don't like diplomacy, join some of the Lone Wolf sectors where everyone is on their own). In any case it is your reputation at stake. We all do have a history here so if you break your deals few will trust you in the future. So that's also something to consider.

Friends, foes and alliances can change throughout a game. It doesn't mean someone is cheating, but that he is reacting to game situation and/or his own personal life. When controlling 100-200 ships the games can take quite a lot time to play so players may prefer to end it when they can. And the motives to end game are not always only for the winner(s), but also for other players. If someone sees they cannot win anymore, they might well prefer to end the game soon and let someone who was friendly and cooperative in the game to win.

I'll recommend @stormfirekiller to read a battle report I wrote about my first game here some 1.5 years ago. In that game my ally decided to end the game with the player in planet lead. It wasn't cheating even though I sure didn't like it, but I think the main point I learned from that game was to get into a position where other people want to ally with YOU and let YOU win the game. So in other words play better, build bigger fleet and crush your enemies without mercy! Here's the battle report:
http://play.planets.nu/#/activity/3312908

246 days, 3 hours, 36 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

"Mursu: For example I haven't encountered a single one in my games."

@Mursu: Are you sure about that?

Wanna bet?

246 days, 3 hours, 26 minutes ago

mursu

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Glyn

Yes. I want to bet. If you can 100% prove there has been a cheater in one of my games, you'll win. If you cannot, I'll win. You can name three other users from this community who will act as arbiters and decide the case.

If I win you will not post a single comment to the Activity Feed for 12 months with any account. If you win, I'll act the same.

Deal?

246 days, 2 hours, 44 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Wow, i just saw this thread and i am really suprised to see that i am accused of cheating?

. Let me clarify this for you stormfirekiller:
Guess why i picked the fascists (the weakest of all races btw): I wanted to have a fun game with no ambition of winning it at all. I thought i could try out the new "double beams" and see how it works. Unfortunately my reading skills are obviously not that good - i saw later that this feature is not active at all in this game and i was pissed about myself not being able to read ^^.

I started the game in the lower left part of the map with the following neighbors to the north and east:

Rebel
+
Bird
+
Fascist + Borg + Crystal
(me)

Borg and myself quickly agreed to for a non-aggression pact and i thought: well, why not. Maybe he gets strong and later i could have a strong ally in form of a carrier race. Alone i would never have chance with this race.

Since Bird is weak as well in the early game as the Borg is, i decided to focus solely on my economy. To my suprise i had really really good mineral planets and natives quite near my HW. Together with self pillage i quickly managed to build up a large Freighter fleet. In turn 10 i had 1 war ship and 9 freighters (almost all LDSF's).

After that i started piling up Vic's non stop with a very fast 2nd starbase. To my suprise the Borg fleet (not his planets) was killed by the Crystal and the Bird player was attacked by the Rebel.

Now comes the fun part: The Borg planets were too strong for the crystal player to take over. His economy was weak and he didn't have many Diamonds. For me however the left over Borg planets didn't mean a problem I just pillaged them (i am NUK/ATT immune) and got even more money. Also: Vic's are cheap and since i have so many beams i decided to take over the Borg planets and go for the Crystal as well.

To my suprise the Bird was either a new player or badly harrassed by the rebel. Also his starting planets are not located very well (to far to the corner of the map). I quickly attacked and destroyed the Bird. This was easy though since he didn't fight back at all. I suppose he abandoned early.

Sorry for the long read but what happened was: I had a strong fleet (110+ ships) and all my neighbors destroyed each other.

I took over their planets and at around 160 planets i checked the scoreboard. Only 40 planets to go.... FED and Lizards had more war ships than i did.

And since the FED (thats you stormfirekiller) attacked me right away i went for the Lizard (north of the rebel and my direct neighbor now) and asked him if he was willing to go for an alliance. Together we would almost have 250 planets. He agreed once we had 250+ planets.

I didn't even know that he was allied with Colonials and that he had to break that up. I only had to do this once in my past and i wasn't very happy about it either. But in order to win sometimes you have to do these things (as long as you don't attack your previous ally that's fine for me).

So that's my statement.

Regards,
Giga - playing since 1995 (German champion i think around 1997) ;-)

P.S.: I have also a game where i accused my enemy of playing together: Vendor Sector where i play the crystals. 3 of those players priv, colonial and 3rd one have played some games together (every time alliance - very fishy). Priv sent out ships across the map turn 5 or so..... We have privately in game accused them. They denied - i cannot proof it. So i play it out 1v3. We are loosing but we are giving them hell of a battle. :)

So i can understand your frustration. But i herewith sincerely and with all honesty tell you that i have never done anything like pre-alliance or any kind of other cheating. And i am pretty sure you will find games in my history where i had an alliance in one game, and the next game i battled them. :) If you need further proof - all admins can check my games and you can have all my turns.
Good luck next games

P.P.S.: Fascists need those double beams - hope they become standard.

246 days, 2 hours, 41 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@martinr:

>Well looking at the game in question it looks to have been one player out performing >three teams of two.
>In this game certain players think you can only work as a team of two and can not >receive help from anyone else.
>They had reached 166 planets and looked to be reaching a difficult time with the >next team of two was on 114 planets.
>So the single player decides they need to reach 200 planets which may be a long haul >and drag the game out. Especially as everyone else realises they need 40 planets to >win and they may all turn on you so making it even harder.

>OR you can approach the next highest player. If they agree you hit the 250 limit and >start the count down.

I should have read the whole thread. You have exactly nailed it to the point sir. :)

246 days, 1 hours, 58 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Mursu: 100% ? What the *#&@ was wrong with 99% ?

I know you didn't read my posts above... but how do you not realize stating 100% as a goal post is just stupid to do?

Is a person saying they are a cheater 100% proof? What if they lied? Is Admins banning the accounts 100% proof? What if the Admins were wrong?

You didn't even define what cheating was. Your MvsM had a farmer... which most call cheating... I know because he was following my advice... I win.
_ _ _

Your assumption that you not posting is a reward to me is outright defamation of my character since it isn't true at all.

I don't dislike people just because they have a different opinion... especially random people online... for all I know you're a bot someone at Google made.

246 days, 1 hours, 42 minutes ago

mursu

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@glyn
You have personally posted the rules to this very same thread.

I gave you the full right to choose ANY three players from this community to act as arbiters and resolve if your arguments are correct. The arbiters would then use their own judgement. I don't think there's any farther I could realistically go except letting you just decide the outcome of the bet.

Your reward is naturally up for a change. I could for example like every one of your posts where you bash Whisperer if that sounds better. Or make a post every month where I praise your superior knowledge of the game and everything.

246 days, 1 hours, 7 minutes ago

sirad

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

[...violating his own promise, with a pityful look on his face clearly showing that he is suffering from reading here just too much...]

... Sirad steps down to the growing and rapidly filling mud Pit, taking energically Mursu's Hand ...

Come on Boy, outta here, you have done well here, but, look, another Settlement needs your Help!

246 days, 1 hours, 3 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Mursu: I posted a link to the site rules to answer a question Marceline asked... so what?

"Mursu: I gave you the full right to choose ANY three players from this community to act as arbiters and resolve if your arguments are correct."

Sirad, Whisperer and you... wait did you mean three people or three accounts?

:D

Do you remember playing with Caverbob? Think even Gigaschatten above has.

246 days, 0 hours, 47 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Capwell: I see you have 'liked' posts but ignored my question about Lumberjack... or simply missed it. Hopefully the latter.
___

"Gigaschatten: P.P.S.: Fascists need those double beams - hope they become standard. "

@Gigaschatten: Good news... they did... you picked a Classic-mode Sector and thus no double beams or the other 3 Race buffs.

Your Vendor Sector I already was contacted to research a few months ago, the accounts in question were added to my high Player Affinity list... I won't investigate further because they have established reasonable doubt they are violating Rule 2. Maybe a closer look would reveal damning info, but I have to cut my losses the second it looks like a group of friends, even if it is a charade.

245 days, 18 hours, 3 minutes ago

aelfgar

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Glyn & @Mursu

How about the loser buys a month or so for the judges and the winner? ;-)
Put your money where your mouth is, eh?

245 days, 17 hours, 59 minutes ago

aelfgar

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Stormfirekiller:

@gigaschatten 's explanation sounds pretty reasonable, don't you think?

245 days, 16 hours, 20 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

I throw my faith in silent reporting through the contact button, its almost like counter espionage, the report doesnt alert a possible abusser , just the ones who will check it

245 days, 15 hours, 20 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Glyn/@Gurgeh,

> I've never called you a cheater till now?

You've made that false claim in the past. I've requested that you prove your false claim. You've chosen to provide none. This is yet another in a long line of your unsupported and unsupportable lies.

> Are you *#&@ing shitting me?

Not at all. The only creature in history that could create a pile such as yourself is the Tyrannosaurus rex. Thankfully, they're extinct, so we won't ever have to put up with another large, steaming, malodorous pile like yourself.

245 days, 15 hours, 9 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Whnsperer: So you chose to lie and play dumb... and focused on a sentence not even about you.

You created alternate accounts to harass me... who does that?

This is why all your insults are a waste of time, no one approves of your behaviour and I refuse to tolerate it. You call people gay online... and you think we respect you?

Notice I don't use insults non-stop? You should give it a try.

245 days, 15 hours, 7 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Hahahahahhha... just noticed the 'Gurgeh' part... so sad he thinks that is an insult... might as well call me Emork or Mentar at this rate.

200 days, 12 hours, 40 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Gigaschatten: Well seeing as a proven cheater has just helped start your Sector within an hour of you joining it and you already finished the 2nd Turn... I'm gonna go ahead and declare you need to be investigated.

http://play.planets.nu/#/sector/289554/events
___

@Mursu: Please note I initiated the bet, you agreed, but then made some bullshit terms.

200 days, 10 hours, 13 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

Another one; http://play.planets.nu/#/sector/289852/events

200 days, 4 hours, 12 minutes ago

RE: Cheating in games I have a couple of cheaters in my...

@Littlepuppi and @Stormfirekiller: Since the game has now ended I took a lot of time to look into it. Good news, nothing suspicious went down your Sector from what I saw.
__

@Gigaschatten: Well your Sector with Chemaz, Xosi and Ferkhan is now winding down so I'll be able to take a look soon enough.

In the meantime I have posted a Player Affinity warning in their other current Sector together since Xosi already claimed Chemaz is RL friend and Xosi gave Ferkhan Intel Sharing as soon as he joined in this Sector; http://play.planets.nu/#/sector/252282

Ferkhan and Xosi share the same account creation date, so I took a look at their first Sector... http://play.planets.nu/#/sector/228819

Turn 13 Xosi gave Share Intel, reciprocated Turn 18... zero communication... never spotted one another as they are on opposite sides of map.

Their over-reaction to Mckones observations has me hoping they did lie.
___

Found this:

Turn 27, lots to investigate; http://play.planets.nu/#/sector/173571/events