Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

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2833 days, 9 hours, 4 minutes ago

Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

I am the Robots in a game against the Crystals. Any suggestions for dealing with web mines?

So far, I have been just laying large numbers of mines over our battlefront, to restrict their movements. This works well because the Robots have the mine laying advantage so it is cheaper for me than it is for them.

But at some point, I am going to have to push forward to start taking planets and I am wondering how to get rid of the web mines. What weapons are best for mine sweeping these? And what their draining of my fuel?

2833 days, 7 hours, 30 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

Did you read these?

http://www.donovansvgap.com/info/weapons.htm (see "Sweeping Mines")

http://www.donovansvgap.com/info/webs.htm

2833 days, 6 hours, 52 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

Bots are good & bad versus the crystal.
Bots have 4x mines, that's good. Keep the Crystal and your fleets smothered in minefields
Bots have the Golem with 2000 fuel, that's good.
Their strongest ship, the Golem has 6 beams, that's bad.
Their strongest sweeper, the Merlin has 450 fuel, that's an expensive sweeper.

Bots vs Crystal is a long slow economic trench war.
Bots have something of an advantage here, but they have to be careful.

QTankers towing Golems reduce fuel losses when forced to drive through webs.
The advantage here is that if the Golem gets killed, the QTanker doesn't really
help the Crystal.

Other towing options have serious liabilities.
I'm sure others will drop different ideas.

2833 days, 4 hours, 26 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

How far along is the game? Are any alliances involved or is it just you vs him?

I'd pick a different target if I were you, but if you must fight, then ... eh, just pick a different target :)

You two are like such a boring matchup. Crystals have no intent to invade Robots because they don't want to deal with the mine fields. Robots should have no desire to invade Crystals cause they don't want to deal with the Crystals.

By the time you two are done fighting over 2 or 3 perimeter planets the game will be over.

As a Crystal player the Robots wouldn't scare me one bit. I would actually welcome a Robot attack because I know I'd end up with nice Robot ships when it was all said and done.

I don't see what Robot really has to gain by attacking Crystal aside from experience and a long drawn out war where they just lose big expensive ships.

Any mine fields you drop he can just sweep up from the protection of webs. He can just enter a minefield drop a couple of small webs around his sweeping party, and clear out your mines with no threat to his sweepers. You'd basically be throwing money away, even if its 4x cheaper for you, its going to cost him nothing to sweep that stuff up, while you risk losing big ships to his webs.

Its just not worth it.

Now, have you considered opening up some dialogue and maybe forming an alliance?

You go from an endless war where neither of you gain much to an alliance that is absolutely devastating when used correctly.

2833 days, 3 hours, 31 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

Thanks oliphaunt - those links were a lot of help.

2833 days, 3 hours, 27 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

Thanks bane - good point about the golem's fuel, but it is too bad they have so few beam weapons for mine sweeping.

2833 days, 3 hours, 26 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

The only chance you have of this not turning into a war of attrition is if your opponent has no idea how to play the crystals. If he's smart, he wont even let your ships near his, you'll just keep chasing him through webs that get replenished as quick as you can sweep. His planets will be surrounded by multiple overlapping web fields, so even if you get to them without running out of fuel you'll probably have taken a good deal of damage. Unless you feel like giving him a few ships, you're better off just agreeing to some kind of DMZ.

2833 days, 3 hours, 24 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

Hi capnkill. I have one partner but the Crystals are my only front. Everyone else is a non-agression pact, The good news is that I only have them to focus on.

The Crystals were a non-aggression pact and they broke it so I have no desire for a treaty - he must die! :)

So far I have been avoiding his webs and laying large mine fields over our front so it is a stalemate. I was looking for a way to break it.

2833 days, 3 hours, 0 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

I think the only advice you'll get is how to best TRY to avoid losing your ships to him :)

If he knows what he is doing, this will be a fruitless effort, however, the best experience gained is by going through the motions yourself...

So have at him and see how it shapes up :) If you have an ally perhaps he can help you out.

I still maintain, that I don't like this attack from your perspective, you have so much more to lose than he does.

A good Crystal player will deploy a large number of Opals to lay down small webs to make your progress nearly impossibly frustrating, but if you can drop surprise mine fields you can definitely neutralize those opals from advancing on you.

Check my old game here: http://planets.nu/games/13236

View the Crystal turn and look at the web deployment in the northern parts, where I've dropped a gazillion tiny webs so you'll get an idea of what kind of crap you'll have to plow through just to make progress. When Crystals drop small interlocking webs like that you have to go through each one and sweep it up and that alone will take ages.

Try to prevent that type of deployment from occurring by dropping mines to neutralize those opals.

What I prefer to do is surround an enemy fleet without actually droping webs on the fleet by those small interlocking chains. Once the fleet is completely surrounded I can then advance and take planets while the fleet is stuck and unable to assist. So make sure you prevent that type of scenario and you'll at least stay out of trouble :)

2833 days, 2 hours, 59 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

I've played the Robots in a few games on the opposite side of the Crystals and I'm currently just throwing Golems at the web-mine fields. Everyone here who said it will be a long drawn out battle are absolutely correct, but with 6-7 Golems in a web-mine field with decent beams you can eventually clean them up. The key is to get them in the same spot and only have fuel on one of them. Each turn you transfer 1 fuel from the main ship to the others and set their mission to Mine Sweep, that way you only loose minimal amount of fuel while getting sweeping done with all the ships. And have plenty of supplies on the Golems to repair any damage you sustain as you move forward into the fields. I do 175 fighters/125 supplies at the moment.

But I agree with a lot of the comments here, I'll reconsider fighting the Crystals next time if there is a chance for cooperation instead ;-)

2833 days, 2 hours, 35 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

I do have one useful thing to say about how you can approach this...

Make sure you sweep with low ID ships.. bring as many low ID sweepers to the front line as you can, because you don't want the Crystals to scoop up the mines from under you, because that will make your progress even slower.

2832 days, 17 hours, 29 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

I would be careful about the whole "put 6 -7 ships at the same spot". If the Crystal has captured a few cloakers (with or without tubes), they can easily predict your waypoint for next turn (considering a Golem can only move 1 ly w/o fuel). And meet up with your stack of ships cloaked. They could then either tow off the fueled ship or tow off one of the unfueled ships. Wash-Rinse-Repeat. Then they can throw the heavies back at ya.

I would use Bane's suggestion, tow the Golem's with Q-Tanker's, but be careful about putting your ships all right on top of one another. Attack several points at once, figure out what they are protecting the heaviest then divert your resources to the weak points. Keep under mine coverage and choke them out as best as you can.

Be careful about apparent holes left in their defenses as they might be playing with you, and never ever be afraid to withdraw and reconsider your assault.

2832 days, 14 hours, 0 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

Please if some day you play against me put 6 or 7 ships in the same spot and most of them with only 1kt of fuel... To lose a diamond flame for destroying one golem with a DF/Ct combo and to gain 5-6 golems because they are fueless after the web drain is the best gift that a crystalline player could have.

I have one other thing to say... I hate low id sweepers.

Tell us how this fight goes.

Regards,

Nite.

2832 days, 13 hours, 53 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

Thanks Veldan and Nitemare,

This has been very informative. I just hope my opponent isn't reading this same thread ;-)

2832 days, 9 hours, 7 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

Usually a Crystal player can gain a cloaker ship, thru trade or capture. And if so, then if the Crystal player notices one ship with high mass and 5-6 other ships in the same spot with low mass, then he can meet those group of enemy ships cloaked and then tow the high mass ship away from the low mass ships -- resulting in a clump of nicely-equipped enemy ships with no fuel.

Edit: above is as veldan suggests .. he is way ahead of me. And his suggestion to attack from several areas is a good one too.

2832 days, 7 hours, 34 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

I guess I now need to start a thread about help on how to defend against incoming base ships. :)

2832 days, 7 hours, 29 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

Just lay multiple overlapping web-mine fields :-) They are a PITA

2832 days, 7 hours, 24 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

Aanold, all you have to worry about is more hangar space for all those new base ships that are being delivered to your door step :)

I mean when a race is so generous as to not only hand you their ships but go the extra mile to bring them to you!... oh man, words just can't express the gratitude for that type of gesture :)

As far as the little thing you need to do are... make sure you drain every single planet of fuel, there should be no planet that the Robots can potentially land on that should have any significant amount of fuel on it... drain it all!!! :)

2831 days, 14 hours, 13 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

This will tell all about our relation ship.
U and EE. EE dont let go of you didnt he. He think you can save him.
I resing from your EE ally.
Me and my other ally have expected that for long time now.

2831 days, 8 hours, 8 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

^^

What in the hell are you talking about :)

2831 days, 8 hours, 6 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

^^
What in the hell are you talking about :)
..

Dont worry capnkill he know what im talking about.

2831 days, 4 hours, 55 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

2831 days, 3 hours, 49 minutes ago

RE: Dealing With Crystal Web Mines

that's the crystal thread, mama.