Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...

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24 days, 7 hours, 14 minutes ago
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ralph_thewiseandpowerfull
Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the old VGA Planets or Planets Nu type game? This site is becoming more and more user unfriendly. Also the Horwasps are ridiculous beyond my understanding. I am restricted by the Ship limit but they can build an endless supply of stingers that do not cost PP, that can gang up on your ships, and every thime they are destroyed they lower your population taking planets by attrition. I mean WTF! It seems that this site has a plan and old VGA players who loved the game are not the demographic they are looking for. Anyone know of any options?

Thanks,
24 days, 6 hours, 40 minutes ago
View col. khlnck's profile
col. khlnck
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
planetscentral.com
BUT it is not even close to Planets Nu. Your best bet is to find the games you like here ( standard..classic...blitz) or privately host games amongst your friends.
24 days, 6 hours, 39 minutes ago
View kite's profile
kite
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
Man, you can play here classic games without Horwasps.
But if you are very angry at planets.nu, you can try playing at PlanetsCentral. But there are only phost games.

Be happy, don't worry.
24 days, 6 hours, 27 minutes ago
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ionmane
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
Yeah Ralph, it is a huge flaw. Horwasp with 300+ ships gumming up the ship limit ruining the game. One thing to remember tho, they dont get merlins so eventually they run out of supply we just have to weather the storm for awhile longer
24 days, 6 hours, 23 minutes ago
View commander koski's profile
commander koski
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
Classic Planets via http://play.planets.nu - no problem. There are often classic senior officer games available, too. Nobody needs to change their gaming habits in any way, even though the site changes.

So could you please elaborate, why would you need to leave the site for classic Planets on some other site, if you've liked it here in the past?
24 days, 6 hours, 17 minutes ago
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ralph_thewiseandpowerfull
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
The Horwasp was just an example and a bit of a rant. Due to upgrades they want to make the site more for people who play on their phones, and less for folk who play on a computer. I did not enjoy the new interface at all. And while there is a fix for playing the game at play.planets.nu for the old interface, I cannot get campaign features without logging off and back in on the new interface. Meanwhile, they are removing what you earned and transferring it to Kin, which I assume is the next step towards a pay and play system. All in all just a much less user friendly environment at each step...maybe I am just an old cranky man. I am just enjoying the experience less and less and wondering if there is an alternative.

Thanks for the input.
24 days, 6 hours, 12 minutes ago
View whisperer's profile
whisperer
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
@Ralph,

There are quite a few of us who don't like the Horwasp. I won't play in a game with them, and I won't generate games where they're allowed in.

Play any Classic game and most Standard games, and you won't see any Horwasp.

Of course, Joshua's still trying to push users towards using the Mobile interface, even though it's still missing some features. I'm hoping he'll change his mind on that one.
24 days, 4 hours, 5 minutes ago
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snid
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
I agree that the trend seems to be towards playing on mobile and I also don't like that. Man, I need a big screen!! However, I can still play the classic games on here, and other games without Horwasp, so I've no problem with .nu . If you go elsewhere you will not get any campaign features.
There may also be an issue with playing the old planets on modern versions of windows? Sure there'll be a workaround for that though.
24 days, 3 hours, 32 minutes ago
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theclerk
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
VPA works well on DosBox. Theoretically you could implement an interface for VPA with the Nu API. But until now Nu is not bad enough for me to start this project :-D
Adding markers for a start would be great.
24 days, 3 hours, 27 minutes ago
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mursu
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
I understood that OP wanted Classic Planets so games without any campaign features (and certainly without Horwasp). I've never played in any game with Horwasp and I've had no difficulty in finding a game in here so I don't know what's the point in getting into another site. I don't like the mobile interface either, but as long as I can just type play.planets.nu and be done with it, I'm fine.
24 days, 2 hours, 28 minutes ago
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ghostrider
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
classic is a good option an probably the best . the future is here . it may be a bumpy road but its a road being upkept, with lots of traffic should you get a flat or break down on a dark stormy night.
Im still in the bug fight, from the start hes mutated but his use of diplo is disasterous for the 11. hes still playing against folks who are just barley learning the 11 an thats a disaster waiting to happen. it seems all the old players are dodging the conflict. but thats aok an fully understandable. I keep hoping for the last mutation that will weakon him to the point of being almost normal.

just from what im seeing now . we need a teaching map of how to deal with the bug. offer it to trainees after they graduate from regular training period .
80 trns, 11 against the bug as an instructional. short learning experience, against a specific known threat.
any way its probably off target of this subject, but I keep hoping for the last mutation .
It aint in me to run.
but classic is a loving home, when I do.
23 days, 20 hours, 8 minutes ago
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renathras
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
I think part of the problem is the switch to the new interface and refusing to continue supporting the old interface. That's a glaring issue, since the new interface (sorry to all you guys who work on it a lot) is just inferior in ALMOST every way. It's clunkier, many things are less easy to understand (I always have to remember the mineral order because something that looks kinda like a D, a +, and an m don't always click in my mind, for example), and when I actually DO try to play it on my phone, it's impossible to do things like transfer cargo between ships and some other things because the interface popups are too large and extend off the screen, meaning I can't get to those things.

...this is also a problem on PC when dealing with a large amount of ships at the same location. I finally found out there's a scroll bar on the right side of the popup window, but it's SO narrow, it's almost impossible for me to click and drag it. I do like a few things, such as the ship motions at the start of your turn (also, if you watch closely, you can see the ion storms move as well), but the old site seems to do almost everything just as well. I've been using the new one for convenience, but I don't really see it as an upgrade. More of a side-grade that hasn't had all the bugs worked out yet.

I don't mind the Kin change, since anyone wanting to spend $10 for 50,000 Kin to buy campaign advantages doesn't matter to me if I'm playing Classic or MvsM games anyway (which is what I've been doing so far).

...but I don't get the Horwasp at all, honestly. They're weird, confusing, and seem to be ridiculously OP while their race advantages list them as under powered in terms of numeric race advantage. But they just look like they'd be REALLY annoying to have to fight, and very confusing to learn to play.

Considering how many other Sci-Fi races are out there that could be added to planets like the Covenant/UNSC (Halo), Confederacy/Old Republic (Star Wars), various Warhammer 40k knock-offs, Centauri/Mimbari/etc (Babylon 5), the Farscape empire-like race (I forget their name, but they had some cool ships and tech), the Asguard or Gould or even the Humans from Stargate (after the Humans got their ships up and working for interstellar travel), etc etc:

There are PLENTY of options for other races that could be added to the game that would function using the same basic systems as the classic 11 - a set of ships, tech levels, and racial advantages - that it seems would require less new game code and cause less balance issues than the Horwasp do. Someone told me something about the Horwasp being an idea of Tim himself, but I've never seen any documentation to support that, and it doesn't really make a lot of sense to me considering just how different they are from the rest.

I get wanting new things, and I get people who like change - but not all change is GOOD change. Getting shot in the leg is a change. Is that a thing you should accept having done to you or just "soldier through" for some supposed future good? Maybe sometimes...but not ALL times. the idea that "the world changes, accept it" has never made rational sense to me. Opposing changes that are bad isn't being "backwards", it's being rational.

Moreover, people that work on big changes like these tend to become married to them and feel they must defend them (even once they realize the aren't so good), which creates some perverse incentives (in the behavioral theory sense) to keep pressing them through, even if they appear to be bad changes. For example, forcing people to use new systems/"upgrades" (smart phone companies do this a lot - Apple even got in trouble for forcing OS upgrades that INTENTIONALLY made older phones slower so that customers would be forced to buy new phones!) is almost universally bad. The only reason to force people to use the new system is if you fear the old system might be better and you don't want "competition" from your own prior system, which makes your new system look bad when lots of people are using/prefer the old one (this is one reason why Blizzard has taken 10+ years to create WoW Classic, even though people have been demanding it for a decade already - they didn't want to acknowledge the fact that people liked Vanilla WoW better than basically any of their new/fancy expansions that they talked up as the best thing ever.)

This is why a mixed/balanced approach is best. Do the new, but segment the old, and keep supporting the old, alongside it.

And if you're going to add new races - COOL! I love new races...in THEORY - just add new races that people want and that play in ways that are kind of in-line with the others. Again, my list above - Halo, Babylon 5, Star Wars, Warhammer, Farscape, Stargate, etc - already have plenty of examples that could be added and make fun races to play without the insanity of the Horwasp, and that would be FAR easier to balance by making small tweaks to their advantages and race lineups.
23 days, 19 hours, 58 minutes ago
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lord krell
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
@RENATHRAS,

Well said.

Lord Krell
23 days, 18 hours, 30 minutes ago
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zacha
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
Well it depends, there are plenty of examples where some old designs have to be scrapped for good to make place and free up resources.
At NU, the resources are likely quite limited. I do not think they can afford to support several versions for long time. So they have to make call - move on with something that is promising for the future, risking to loose some people as the way is always bumpy, or stick for all time with the old system, which in the end is surely doomed as it got an inferior perspective.

Frankly speaking, I am just wondering why so few people here are using the highly add-friendly system to do their own enhancements. The coding is not THAT difficult, and it seems to me that people who like PLANETS likely should have also some affinity to programming - but maybe that is just me. Wish I had a bit more time, then I would do more myself, currently my private developing capacity is limited to my excel planning sheet :)
23 days, 16 hours, 6 minutes ago
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renathras
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
@Zacha - the problem is, I don't see the new system as "promising for the future". The new website is clunky, has a worse user interface, and for reasons that make sense to no one, disallows the old website from interacting with a lot of features like campaign research (features the old system PREVIOUSLY did, in fact, have, meaning either they intentionally removed it to force people to the new system, or they intentionally changed the coding for the new system and accidentally made it incompatible with the old system...neither of which is a sterling example of good design.)

It's like they're trying to tap into the already over-tapped mobile gaming market of Farmville, Egg Inc, etc, which is a saturated market of shallow P2W games that people playing Planets aren't interested in and that people who like those kinds of games won't generally be all that interested in Planets. But they are trying to have their cake and eat it, too, by having one application for both platforms, instead of making (a) a dedicated mobile ap and (b) a dedicated PC browser interface. They're trying to force both into using the same system, but it's not well suited to both venues, and is actually ill suited to doing both. Basically you end up with an application trying to do both platforms, and failing at doing either that well, while letting a previous system that worked great for PC languish.

The better option would be to simply use those limited resources on a slower rollout of a new system for mobile while continuing to maintain the old system for PC. I started playing just about 7-8 months ago, under the old system, and I played it on my iPhone just fine as well as my PC, btw. So it's not like the new system is even absolutely needed.

So that's what I mean by "not all change is good change".

You talk about scrapping "old designs" and an "old system" while promoting the "promising for the future" new system. That's propaganda speech, honestly. I'm not saying that's your intent, but people do that a lot. They talk up the novel, the new, the young, the "promising", the "future", and talk down the old, tried and true, battle tested, reliable, functional, as "the past" or "old" or "worn out" - as if everything has some kind of sell-by date.

The reality is, a lot of old things WORK, and work WELL. The world still uses gold as a reserve precious metal 2,000+ years on. The basic form of combat in war still comes down to personal rifles. Ships still generally have a base hull, planes generally still have two wings, a tail, and a stabilizer. Cars still use wheels.

There are reasons we keep doing things that are "old" - sometimes they work. Sometimes they may need minor tweaks, but "minor tweaks" is "continued support", not entire reworks or new systems and discarding both the bad AND THE GOOD of the old systems.
23 days, 15 hours, 54 minutes ago
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rexe
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
The new interface has a lot of improvements. There's a lot of CAVEs (Citizens against virtually everything) hanging around this site doing a lot of complaining.

If you use the interface for more than 20 minutes, you find that it saves space by not repeatedly displaying 0/0 for each mineral on each ship. The hover text is improved, and the sorting of the planets/ships is better.

Mainly, the icons and the text shrinks better than on the old one -- so it is actually capable of being moderately functional on mobile (no hover-text is a bit hard).

Once they fix the add-ons / plug-ins, it'll be quite good. It's still quite good for those that use it and don't know differently.
23 days, 15 hours, 49 minutes ago
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zacha
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
Of course not all change is good change. But it needs to be changed to become better.
One can argue if this is the best approach in this case. I just try to explain what I think why the Devs are going this way.
BTW., they are not changing the whole game just to make it mobile friendly. It is just the user interface. Gold is by far not the standard currency anymore. War decisive weapons were 100 years ago the artilley, then tanks and planes, than atomic bombs and today likely it will by cyberwarfare. Ships are rarley made of wood, Planes, well, based on the evolutionary million years old design of birds are not so prone to major changes, and cars may still have wheels but the classic engine is about to expire.
So things change, some more radicall, some less.

If you have the resources to go several ways, that's fine. If not - well, you have to make a call. Not changing the very challenging and old-fashioned core of the game, but just creating a new User Interface, seems a small change to me.

And seriously, I think it would not be so difficult for die-hard old schoolers to do some modding to get the old feeling back - if they really know what's bothering them.
23 days, 11 hours, 57 minutes ago
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renathras
RE: Does anyone know if there is a place to play more of the...Write Reply
You have to understand: I used the old system for 2-4 months before switching to the new system. I'm not married to the old system or some old timer "resisting change" or "doing a lot of complaining". I'm telling you, from a person NEW TO THE INTERFACES, the old interface felt more intuitive and useful to me than the one one does. If you REALLY want a "promising future" and "lot of improvements", at the least you should be paying attention to what people like me are telling you.

While there are people that complain about everything, there are also people that white knight, too. The extreme of supporting change no matter what is no better than the extreme of opposing change no matter what. As I've noted in my posts, I'm not opposed to change, I just think it has to be paced and balanced, and if there are ways to mitigate the negatives, they should be employed.

Gold never was the "standard currency", nor did I say it was. Coinage has been a thing forever, which has been gold, silver, copper, etc. Before that, there were bartering systems. I said gold is still used as a "reserve precious metal", and this is still true - in fact, many nations such as Russia and China have increased their gold reserves, and they aren't the only ones that have been doing so. I didn't mention "decisive weapons", but since we're going there, I'll note that wars were not won by artillery, then tanks and planes, then atomic bombs, then cyberwarfare. Point to me a single war that's been won by cyberwarfare. Sure, some new types of wars may go there, but it will be part of a grander scheme. Only ONE war in history was won with atomic bombs. And even the wars won with tanks and planes - WWII, Vietnam, Korea, Gulf - were not won with tanks and planes. Tanks and (particularly) planes supported ground troops with...rifles.

...in fact, TO DATE, no war has been won without men with rifles. Not. One. There has been not a single war won by air power alone. Or by cyberwarfare. Or by tanks without men.

It can be argued that every single war was won by men with rifles. Even WWII's Pacific theater - the only way the atomic bomb was able to be put on a plane that had enough range to get to Japan's mainland was because of...men with rifles taking the islands and capturing/building the airstrips that they could launch from.

Ships are "rarely made of wood"? My first ship, Avenger class MCM, was made of wood. The entire line were (and it's one of the reasons they are superior to the LCS in the minesweeping/hunting role, btw). And you also moved the goal posts here, as I was talking about hull design.

Basically, you moved the goalposts, but mostly proved my point even when you did - tweaking existing designs is the method of true progress, not tossing the old designs aside.

This even applies to cars - hybrids are the future, not all electrics (which have a bigger environmental footprint overall due to the toxic metals needed for production of batteries and renewables, as well as the larger environmental impact of large solar, wind, and geothermic farms). Indeed, if we weren't on this stupid "zero carbon emissions" stupidity (which is abjectly impossible without people being willing to give up a modern lifestyle), we'd already have slashed carbon emissions MORE than we have by focusing on refining "dirty" technology rather than trying (and failing) to replace it with "clean" technology that is actually worse for the environment.

.

But all of this is talking in far bigger terms.

My point is still valid, and even with your attempts to move the goalposts, I think I've hammered that home more than enough:

1) Good change is fine.
2) Not all change is good.
3) Sometimes old IS better.
4) If you're going to implement new, maintain old or tweak old - this generally leads to better results.