Fast guide for newcomers

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3123 days, 12 hours, 14 minutes ago
View kissofpain's profile
kissofpain
Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply

I am a VGA Planets veteran, who just find out this jewel of a game. :)

I jumped into an ongoing game to see how can I do in harsh circumstances. To my disapointemnt, the previous player had build a lot of medium freighters with lvl 6 or 7 engines. This made me write the following fast guide for new players.

1. Engines

Dont't build anything else than lvl 10 engines for ur ships. Anything else is just not efficient.

Trick: If you fight with a carrier race, u may notice that big carriers require a lot of engines (gorbie class for instance). It may be wise to build ur initial carriers with lvl 1 engines and tow them arround.

2. Freighters

For expanding ur empire, build only Large freighters, as those are the most efficient.

3. Combat Ships

Beam only ships are generally not efficient. You will notice that each race has an overall efficient medium ship somewhere arround lvl 6 hull tech. This means the best combination between firepower and cargo. These ships are as follows:

Feds: Nebula Class
Lizards: Lizard Class
Birds: Fearless Class (cloak, good cargo), Death Specula Class (cloak, good weaponry, low cargo).
Fascist: D7 (cloack, fair weaponry, good cargo), Ill Wind (doesn't cloak, good cargo, great hull, great weaponry), Death Specula.
Privateers: MBR
Cyborg: Firecloud Class
Crystals: Emerald Class
Empire: Super Star Frigate (the only torpedo ship), Super Star Destroyer
Robots: Cats Paw (the only torpedo ship). Instrumentality (great fighter ship for lvl 6, low cargo tho)
Rebel: Tranquility Class
Colonies: Cobol Class

4. Early expansion.

Game tutorial sais its best to build a Large freighter in first turn. My opinion is to build 2 combat ships first and to move as fast to ur neighbours, while droping clans on nearby planets. Try to move stealthy if possible (jumping from planet to planet). Dont use cloack (if available) until u feel u are close enough to ur neighbour. This strategy will allow u to get as much land as possible when u will negociate a peace treaty with ur neighbours. Note that a large freighter will certanly only get killed in an encounter.

Trick (thanks to veldan for reminding me this): When the next planet is 2 jumps away from your ship location, dont move directly to that planet. Select instead a waypoint between the 2 planets. This way the enemy will not be able to see where u are coming from, as ur ship will appear as just sitting in space, opposed to when u have a clear waypoint. If there are more planets where u can go or come from, try to set a waypoint between them, so that the enemy will not know for sure where u go or come from. Just make sure u will arrive at ur destination in 2 turns, ok? :)

Once u get 2 combat ships out its time to build ur first large freighter. U will use it to colonise ur planets with natives first, as this is where the money come from. I take priority in ghipsoidals and humas, as they offer the greatest benefits when building starbases. And you will want as many good starbases fast, in order to build as many good ships until the ship limit is reached.

If your combat ships and initial medium freighter have discovered many native planets, its good to build another freighter. If u are not lucky, then build another 2 combat ships and send them towards enemy border aswell.

Use ur freighters to expand above and bewllow ur homeworld, where u are not likely to jump into enemy ships.

5. Base tech level

Best tech level for your base for the first turns is Engine 10, Hull 6, Beam and Torp 5.
Personally I go for Beam lvl 5 and not 6 because disruptors ocasionally allow u to capture an enemy ship (like a large freighter for instance) in the first skirmishes.

6. Fuel

Don't fully load ur ships with fuel when leaving ur homeworld. You will run fast out of fuel on ur homeworld this way. Besides, fuel counts towards ship mass, so the more fuel you get onboard, the more fuel u will consume for your travel. 

Uncolonized planets always have some neutronium on surface. Use this to your advantage and use the beam up fuel mission while droping clans and move to other planets. Beam up fuel works before the ship moves, so you will never run out of fuel this way, while colonizing in the initial stages of the game.

Well, this is it, I hope this will be of help. And thank you for reading. :)

Edit: Some typos and added veldan sugestion when moving between planets

3122 days, 22 hours, 3 minutes ago
View automcdonough's profile
automcdonough
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
You guys need a serious primer on friendly codes in here.
3122 days, 21 hours, 37 minutes ago
View veldan's profile
veldan
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Good guide.  I've played on and off since version 3 back in 1991.  And I agree I've seen a few too many players running around with nova drive 5s, quantum dirves (which are IMHO just fine for Probes and Falcons), and hyper drive 8's.  Yes, they're expensive, but you will regret not having transwarps on all of your ships.

Friendly codes are outlined in the "how to play" section.  Or google "donovan vga planets"

Also, don't expose where your ships are coming from.  If you need to end a turn in deep space, make that your end point.  Too bad we don't have VPA capabilities like drawing circles of any size around ships and planets so you can figure the best places to step to create the most confiusion as to where your ship originated from and where your ship is going.  I have identified homeworlds in three of my games within the first 5 turns just based on heading of ships.

3121 days, 17 hours, 10 minutes ago
View admiral_thrain's profile
admiral_thrain
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
I agree that there is a lot of things the current playerbase can do better and creating a fast guide is a good thing. For example, I just killed an Annihilation which was armed with Mk2 torps... My Darkwing didn't even lose shields.

However, there is some cases where I disagree with kissofpain...

1. Which engines to use depends on your money situation and which ship you are building. You don't need transwarps for all ships or t1 engines to your carriers and tow them (you have a useless t1 engined carrier if it's tower gets blown up). Hyper drives and nova drives have their uses. But do prefer Transwarps.

2. Depends on what race you play. Borg for example does a very good job in using MDSFs for expansion instead of LDSFs. And in some cases it's more viable to build STF rather than LDSF. However, LDSF is the freighter you should build, generally speaking.

3. Which ship to use depends what is meant do and some of the races shouldn't use any of the T6 or lower ships in fighting...
Feds: Nebula for minelaying and torp supply for other ships, Diplomacy, Thor, Kitty, Loki, Missouri (main combat ship), Nova (only for heavy duty that Missouri can't do). You'll have enough cash to increase the hull tech to 9 or 10 very quickly.
Lizards: LCC for colonist drops. You can afford to use T-Rex as your main combat ship. Madonnzilas are good as well when accompanied with T-Rexes.
Romulans: Resolute hands down is your mid size combat ship, but Darkwing is the one that does the real fighting.
Klingons: Coldpains for freighter hunting, pillaging, GA. Ill Winds have their uses. Victorious does your fighting. Mass produce Glory ships!
Privateers: Don't fight, ROB! You don't fight with any of your ships except if against freighters.
Borg: You'll build shitloads of probes and connect your empire with Fireclouds. Cubes do your fighting. If you must fight with other ships than Cubes, use Fireclouds, but you should expand your empire so that it doesn't matter if you lose your HW and many other planets. Just chunnel your fleet to somewhere safe and come back later to kick ass with Cubes. You are the only race that can win the game with 1 clan and 1 supply.
Tholians: Why destroy something you can drain out of fuel and have yourself? Emerald and Ruby for webbing and Diamond Flames and Crystal Thunder combos for combat.
EE: Don't fight with your only torp ship (SSF), it gets captured. It's main task is to mine. Super Star Carrier is better in fighting than SSD and Super Star Cruiser is even better, but it's T9. Gorbie is you real fighting ship and probes for probing.
Cylon: Instru for fighting, Cat's Paw for minelaying. Automas do your main fighting and Golems are for other heavy carriers.
Rebel: All your ships have very low mass expect Rush so you need combos in the early game and Rush in the mid to late game. Cygnus + Patriot can take quite a few single ships down (sim first) if you must fight. Tranquility is for minelaying and supplying. Falcons with T1 or T5 engine and single laser for hyperjumping RGA "missiles".
Colonials: Cobols for most of the noncombat duties, Virgos for fighting although you could use Cygnus + Patriot as well...

4. Early expansion strategy depends which race you are playing and your starting location, but I agree that killofpain has it right in most parts. :)

5. Engine tech 10 is a must. Everything else is race dependant. Most go for T6 to get LDSF, as Romulans for example I go for T7 to get Resolutes. Torps to 5 for torp races and rest can do with 1 until they decide are they going to use mk4 or Mk7 for minefields. Beams... if you must raise the tech, T5 is fine for starters.

And one more thing that wasn't mentioned earlier is use mk4 or mk7 torps (or mk8 if you must and have the cash). Gamma Bombs has their use, but everything else is waste money and/or resources.

READ THE GUIDES IN DONOVAN'S SITE!!! They might be written in the last millenium, but they are mostly up to date. Ignore most what's written in the Birdmen guide to galaxy.
3121 days, 14 hours, 8 minutes ago
View kissofpain's profile
kissofpain
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply

Good additions.

I think I forgot to mention that all the ships I listed are meaned for initial expansion. The point is to be able to carry as many clans/supply/torps and still put a good fight/survive in an initial skirmish. Once the economy is rolling and u have enough MC to go for better hulls, there are of course new options.

But again, the main point is to have the best chances to survive in the initial encounters with your neighbours. This is decisive on the diplomatic relations that will follow. If you lose the first fight, you will likely get a bad deal. If you win the first fight you can be cocky when negociating. Of course, there will be neighbours that will seek a fight at any cost. Privateer being prolly the main offender here.

I think that playig Romulans with Resolutes early will put them in a MC shortage, wich means this is not a good idea for a new player. Thos its clear that Resolute >> Fearless/Death Specula

Also Rebel and Colonies cygnus+patriot combo is good for fighting, tho I personally prefere guardian when playing rebels. However, when it comes to expansion, its clear to me that Tranquility 380 cargo is way better than cygnus 50. Also Tranquiliy has a biger mass so will last more in border skirmishes.

Regarding EE, I think I forgot about SSF low crew. SSCa is also a good option, not to mention it have a good cargo too, tho early one will lack the MC to build the fighters required to fight. While on the other hand, SSD has its utility (Imperial Assault).

Anyway, I will update the guide with some of the advices.

Edit: Umm, strangely, I can't edit again the orginial post...

3121 days, 10 hours, 12 minutes ago
View lutwidge's profile
lutwidge
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
A small word on engine tech - a lot of times I'll build a freighter ship for a specific shuttle route between a starbase and a supply planet, and then the engine tech depends entirely on the distance between the two worlds.  For instance, if it is 100 light years, a Quantum Drive is as good as a Transwarp.  Also, sometimes a ship is built entirely as a sacrificial first wave in a tandem, such as a Diamond Flame/Crystal Thunder combo.  In such cases, it is often feasible to simply tow the Flame with the Thunder into battle.  I find this particularly useful with the Robots when using an Automa/Golem combination, as the Automas have six(!) engines.

As far as economy, I get the feeling that it is more important than one might realize at first to colonize EVERY planet and set up a supply chain as quickly as possible - at least 100 factories, unless it's a cash planet (i.e., lots of natives and/or bugs/birds/unity).  This is true even of amorphous planets!  100 clans will survive there, albeit painfully.  Even planets with extreme temperatures are possible to set up shop in with enough supplies to keep the colonists going - there's a chart somewhere on Donovan's site that explains how this works.  Anyhow, though this process is admittedly tedious, VGAP games tend to last many turns and one needs to consider things from that perspective and not simply where one's next megacredit fix is coming from.   There are many times in my first games here that I've run out of crucial minerals that could easily have been procured from a not far off planet had I bothered to cultivate it properly.

Also, save some of your supplies!  It is almost inevitable that you will eventually need to build a Merlin (and/or Refinery) to supplement your dwindling resources, at which point supplies become one of the most valuable commodities in the game (hence the importance of Bovinoid planets - build Starbases on them whenever possible!).

Anyhow, just my .2 megacredits,

- L.

3121 days, 2 hours, 10 minutes ago
View challengespaceyard's profile
challengespaceyard
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
kissofpain wrote:
Edit: Umm, strangely, I can't edit again the orginial post...
You can edit a post if it's less than 24 hours old.
3120 days, 9 hours, 12 minutes ago
View automcdonough's profile
automcdonough
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
"Friendly codes are outlined in the "how to play" section.  Or google "donovan vga planets""

can't find it in how to play, and having to search out an outside wiki to learn how to play the game is precisely my point! It's also dated and obviously for a different version, what confidence do I have that all of them will work, or that it's a 100% complete list? 
You guys keep throwing it out there like "duh", honestly this is the first game in the last 15 years I've had to use google to figure out the interface. People's strategy guides I can understand, but to simply know about all of the games features and how to use them should not need a network of support sites.
3120 days, 8 hours, 57 minutes ago
View veldan's profile
veldan
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
http://www.donovansvgap.com/help/friendlycodes.htm

I was mistaken about the "how to play" section, my apologies (Think I was confusing that with Tim's Site).  If one of those friendly codes do not work, then its a bug and needs to be reported. 
3119 days, 17 hours, 6 minutes ago
View kissofpain's profile
kissofpain
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
At this point I would like very much to edit the OP and update the guide with friendly codes, but I can't. :| 

Btw, I remember at some point I wrote an answer to veldan and autom, but somehow I think I forgot to post it. Basically I wanted to thank veldan for his feedback on moving ships between planets that are more than 1 jump away, wich I updated the guide with. ;)

At that point I didn't thought friendly codes are of big importance, but now I realise I was kinda wrong. 
3119 days, 7 hours, 17 minutes ago
View veldan's profile
veldan
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Maybe repost your entire quick start guide and once people are "okay" with it.  (you'll never really get consensus)  Submit it to Joshua and have him post it somewhere in the "how to play" section of this site.

As for knowing all of the games features and intricacies... I think that's what always limited Planets appeal, because you can't just jump in and play and do well.  (Kinda like Chess, it takes a short amount of time to learn, but a lifetime to master)
3118 days, 16 hours, 0 minutes ago
View kissofpain's profile
kissofpain
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply

Truer words were never spoken :)

Also if new players will ask for help in game from their neighbours, I am sure most of them will find there are great people out there that will do their best to help them. :) This will significantly reduce the learning curve.

3117 days, 18 hours, 28 minutes ago
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zapp brannigan
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
My thoughts on engines:

I disagree with the philosophy that you want EVERYTHING with warp 9 (tech 10) engines.  For freighters and one or two engine warships, yes, by all means go for the top drive.  But for the big multi-engine ships it is too expensive for the most part.  Maybe build a couple big ships with warp 9s when you can afford it, but for the most part I prefer warp 7s on the big ships, just tow them when you need to move quickly.  Warp 7 is plenty when you get close to make the attack run, and the savings will allow you to build more ships.

On the other hand, avoid warp 1 engines (except possibly for a Lady Royale in the earliest stages of the game that is never going to move, period.)  Even if you plan to always tow your Merlin or whatever, if something happens to the towing ship it's completely stranded if it has warp 1 engines.  I prefer warp 5 at minimum -- in an emergency the ship can still move (albeit slowly) and the cost is still pretty economical.
3117 days, 17 hours, 23 minutes ago
View kissofpain's profile
kissofpain
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply

Back in the days, when I played carrier races, I tried diffrent combinations. Here are my conclusions:

If u're defending, u're usually mining ur territory, so u can move safe ur lvl1 engine ships with 2 engines low hp ships. No need for anything else than lvl1 for those carriers meaned to be on homeguard

While when u're attacking u're usually under the enemy minefields pressure, so u'll want to tow ur carriers with other carriers that can take more minehits and still hold. Cos if not, than half of ur fleet might not get to the target, wich in most cases will make u lose the battle. And if u lose the battle, u'd better be sure ur stranded ships will get intercepted and killed, be them lvl 1 or lvl 7 engines. This being the case, why bother and build anything else than lvl1 on a ship that is meaned to be towed?

Also I'd like to mention the only time when I build lvl 7 engine carriers was when I played shareware. :)

3017 days, 8 hours, 54 minutes ago
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neil raskatovich
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply

About the Engine Tech Level discussion: I think that We shall take into consideration the Scenario that We are playing, regarding the HOST parameter "Engines Boost Shield Power". 

If this is set to False, then a ship with Tech1 Engines will fight as well as Tech10 Engines.

So If you want to build a ship for defending a planet, not to be moved for a long long time, you can build it with Tech3 Engines and tow it to destination point!
3015 days, 8 hours, 18 minutes ago
View bondservant's profile
bondservant
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
One more note to you Mr./Mrs. Newcomer.  You have read lots of advice and tried to follow it best you can.  But how do you know if you are getting a good start in your game?  Try comparing your "Score" (not Military Score) to the other players' scores.  If it is far below the leaders' scores, then there is a good chance there is something you are not doing very well to develop your economy compared to the other players.  Try to read everything above and the guides on Donovan again to see what that might be. 

And what if your score is better than the others?  Well eventually make time to read many of the guides again anyway, because VGA Planets is filled with nuances that even the veterans learn, forget, and relearn again in order to carry them to victory.

Bond
3015 days, 7 hours, 50 minutes ago
View lutwidge's profile
lutwidge
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
One caveat to the military score charts: several races tend to lag behind in that for quite some time before their economic/strategic advantages make themselves felt. For instance, in the case of the Borg sometimes a high early military score suggests weakness, not strength, as it means that instead of expanding wildly they have chosen to build one large cube at the expense of their future economy.  Well, either that or everyone else is already screwed. :)

EDIT: D'oh, bond's (previous) post was about the normal score, not the military score.  Er, nevermind. :)
3015 days, 7 hours, 44 minutes ago
View bondservant's profile
bondservant
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Yes I agree.  Newcomers should look at their Scoreboard's "Score" for a better barometer instead of "Military" to determine how well (or not) they may be developing their expanding empire.

EDIT -- lutwidge, if YOU (a premier Tholian player) did not initially notice the difference, then it is more likely that a newcomer would not as well, so it's worth the extra emphasis to them on what score they should initially have their eyes on in the scoreboard.
3014 days, 9 hours, 7 minutes ago
View donaldworrell's profile
donaldworrell
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
lutwidge mention building Merlins and  Refinery ships.   This is some thing you have to plan for your original homeworld as you will run through minerals and fuel as the game goes.  But some thing else that is important for new people to understand is where to build your second starbase.

The short answer is this example.  If you are going to move to the north to colonize planets you do not want to have to haul colonist all the way from your homeworld to do it.  You need to find a nice planet near 50 degress (so population will grow) and get at least a large deep frieghter worth of clans to it to start grwowing.   Do this for the n,s,e,w and you will make things alot easier on your self as the game goes on.  Growing colonist is a key concept to learn.
3014 days, 8 hours, 34 minutes ago
View lutwidge's profile
lutwidge
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
To be honest, a lot of the suggestions I'm tossing around here are simply those born of hindsight - i.e., things I neglected to do (or didn't do early enough) in the three games I'm in here and rather wish I had. :)

Btw, two side notes regarding the Crystals, for they're a somewhat unique race:

1) In general it is more effective to lay small, overlapping webfields, and be aware that you can lay them in other races ID and that web drain affects ships orbiting enemy/unknown planets.

2) Learn how Ion Storms work!  While a sound grasp of Galactic Meteorology is important for any race, as Nu tends to generate rather a lot of inclement weather (or is it simply Cosmic Warming?), it is for the Crystalline absolutely crucial to understand how they function - I didn't and paid dearly for it in Beta 1. :)


3014 days, 1 hours, 57 minutes ago
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db
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
This is very helpful... thanks for posting it!
3012 days, 10 hours, 34 minutes ago
View kosh's profile
kosh
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Hmm that engine thing. There are ships what are awsome regards of their engine tech.
Empire can build warp9 SSD and tow GORBIE with warp1 engines.
Same goes to borg towing cubes with fireclouds.

And starter mention empire.. SSF. Its not good torp ship, it got crew so tiny, that it would be captured ez. That why its mining vessel for empire.
And SSD is weak ship. I would rather use SSC.
SSD is good to take enemy planets without a fight, but an bad fighter ship to ship combat, with its 3 fig bay and weak hull. But its good tow ship or fighter collector from empire bases.




3011 days, 22 hours, 24 minutes ago
View chaos1357's profile
chaos1357
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
SSCruiser is better then the SSD in almost every instance, with the exceptions being cost and the Imperial Assault ability.  If you think you can pull of enough IA's to make it work, build SSDs.  Otherwise, if you can, build SSCruisers.  Even then, SS Anything is wasted against built up starbases or end game ships.  The SSCarrier, on the other hand, is, in my opinion, not worth the resources required to build more then one or two, and even then, only for fighter transport. 

However, and this can't be stated strongly enough, the SSD makes a POOR tow ship, especially for the likes of a Gorbie.  It only has 180 tons of fuel, and doesn't get the best mileage to start with, so you are far better using something with a larger tank to tow Gorbies.  If you are going to tow them at all.

That's right, if.  Building a low tech engine ship and towing it with a higher tech one... well, that's all well and good, but consider a couple things.

1 - unless your opponent never sees you coming (planet hopping and avoiding his planets and ships until too late), he will know which ship is being towed (warp 0).

2 - considering 1, that means that he can strand your gorbie (or biocide, or virgo (and 8 engines per, a virgo sucks cash to build with t-warps)) by simply intercepting it with a ship strong enough to beat it.  Towing with a SSD?  Ok, I'll just intercept with my Ill Wind and strand your Gorbie.  Towing a Biocide with a Firecloud?  Kill the FC with my Resolute and just let the Biocide set in deep space and rot. 

3 - Because of 2, you want to build your big bruisers with T-warps... and if you want to use the tow trick, build a 2nd one with tech 7s (or at least 5s).  Have your big ship to another big ship.  If your towing a Gorbie with another Gorbie, your opponent will need to throw a heavy force at your to kill even just the towing ship.  If your second ship has at least mid level engines, it won't be exactly dead in space once the towing ship goes boom.
3011 days, 22 hours, 21 minutes ago
View mugulor's profile
mugulor
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
I agree on the SSD, it is not a fighting ship. You use it in coordination with other ships to isolate an enemy base or heavily armed planet from any defenders so you can take it with the Imperial assault.
But the SSF is vital if you are fighting cloaked races. The Empire is like the Borg in that it takes a while to build strength. The cloaking races can decimate you in the early game and unless you have allies with Lokis, GDs or decent torpedo ships to trade, the SSF is your only defense.

As for building battleships/carriers with warp1 or warp9 always build with warp9 when you can, but if you can only scrape together enough to build a big ship with decent armament and lo tech engines, build it anyway. I would rather tow a Gorbie into battle than not have one at all.
You can run your towing ship out of fuel each round and keep your fuel supply on your main ship to counter cloaked intercept.
3009 days, 7 hours, 41 minutes ago
View kosh's profile
kosh
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Chaos. I disagree that SSD is poor tow ship for gorbie.
Gorbie got huge FUEL tank, so it can transfer fuel to the SSD.

And that ship what is under tow can got warp 9 set, even it got warp1 engines. It dont move, its begin towed, remember?

SSC& SSCruiser are pretty much equal agaist capital torp ships. Agaist fighter race Cruiser shoots down 4-6 fighter more. Only think what really seperate them is Molyb usage. And SSC or Cruiser should never fly solo. two of them with 40-45 fighters kill majority of capitals ships there is.

I didnt say you need to tow warp1 ships, they can got warp6 engines aswell. Lot cheaper than 6-10 Transwarp drives. Expecial when you know that capital ship is going to be destroyed.

But hey. This is strategy game, you cant always do that same thing. You need to adopt to the surrounding. Only basic guide lines are there.
I think many of things can be worng and right, but it will depend your current situtation.



3009 days, 4 hours, 27 minutes ago
View chaos1357's profile
chaos1357
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply

Every time I've towed a ship, the next turn it has it's speed set to 0.  This allows your opponent to determine which ship is towing and which is towed.

Personally, I devide my ships into Defensive (low tech engines), Offensive (transwarps), and sacrafice (mid tech engined torp ships to lead combat)

3009 days, 4 hours, 25 minutes ago
View kosh's profile
kosh
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
It should if you got atleast 1kt fuel in tank. You can put warp 9 in your warp1 engines and not move at all. Why it would be zeroed?




3009 days, 4 hours, 9 minutes ago
View chaos1357's profile
chaos1357
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
it was happening last time I did a serious tow.  the tow ship would have fuel and a speed set, but would be reset to warp 0 the next turn.
3009 days, 4 hours, 5 minutes ago
View kosh's profile
kosh
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Chaos...

Why you fly so far that you end up with fuel with tow ship?
And SSD with fighters and 180 fuel can tow Gorbie around.
Ez, even Gorbie got good payload.

How many fuel and fighters you put in your Gorbie( death star, DS)  normaly?
3009 days, 2 hours, 16 minutes ago
View chaos1357's profile
chaos1357
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
I haven't towed a gorbie yet with anything other then a MBR, and then only a single turn for a surgical strike.

However, if I'm towing around big ships, it's ultimately going to be more then a single hop.. so I haven't built a single Gorbie this cycle without Twarps.  I have 3 Virgos in another game that are only usefull as fighter factories and fixed defense because even with Cobols, I can't affort to be towing them across the map every tun.


3009 days, 2 hours, 8 minutes ago
View sirius113's profile
sirius113
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
In my games as Colo/Liz/... i build 1 tw big ship and 1 sd1 big ship. That ship with the tw towed the sd ship. Works pretty well. Engines are expensive (and u need a lot for carriers) and Lizards have to throw so many ships at an enemy, it isnt worth to put tw on every ship.
Just let the bad ships attack first ^^

Btw, ur using Virgos to produce fighters? oO
Get some Geminis :P
3008 days, 22 hours, 27 minutes ago
View chaos1357's profile
chaos1357
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
I have geminis working the fighter production... but being as ship limit hit, I"m building all the fighters I can.. that includes Virgos that aren't on the front line (my "defensive" fleet... a few tech 6 virgos)

Heck, I have Patriots that aren't currently busy doing other work building... every fighter counts you know.


3008 days, 12 hours, 38 minutes ago
View kosh's profile
kosh
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
You got patriots?

Hehe are you kindin me?
30 cargo bay and its not even a fighter. That can kill scouts, nothing more. Cos of the weak hull.
Colonials are all about Virgos and Cobols. And thats it.





3008 days, 11 hours, 33 minutes ago
View chaos1357's profile
chaos1357
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
2 of them will kill an emerald more often then not if used right.  Or a firecloud.  or planets that don't have large defense outpost counts (I forget the cutoff, but unless you are Borg, Fed, or Liz, you likely haven' spent enough on defense outposts to stop a patriot)

They are not a high end fighter.  But the game is not filled by nothing but gorbies, biocides, and novas.  Sure, patriots are mainly single shot weapons.  But they do have a place in a fleet.
3008 days, 11 hours, 1 minutes ago
View kosh's profile
kosh
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Watch your Combat VCR...

SCC or Cruiser wont loose to the emerald, ever :)

3008 days, 10 hours, 57 minutes ago
View kosh's profile
kosh
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
And even if your best ship is 99% shield, it would be bad agaist fighter races.
Cos it lauch "free" fighers on the air.

3008 days, 10 hours, 41 minutes ago
View chaos1357's profile
chaos1357
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Colonials don't have SSC or SSCrusiers....

Sure, a Virgo would be better.  But a useful Virgo is far more expensive then a useful Patriot.  I'm not saying build a lot of patriots, but a good colonial player will have a few in his fleet.
3008 days, 10 hours, 0 minutes ago
View sirius113's profile
sirius113
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
If you dont have enough ressources for a Virgo, you have to build something else. And a Patriot hits harder and is cheaper than a Cobol.
Patriots cost only 2 pbp, while Virgos cost 13. At the 500 shiplimit its quiet important to build as many ships as possible, and thats easier with Patriots.

Btw, the first post sounds like, u generally build only 3 kind of ships
Midsize, ur main fight ship and LDSF.
Thats not true ^^
Just take Lizards for example.
T-Rex, LDSF and LCC's are fine, but u need Merlin, Neutr Ref Ships as well, later on. NFC's have their uses aswell, Eros for cooling and hissing, Loki for decloaking and Reptiles, sometimes Saurians for scouting (a LCC would just need to much fuel for it).

And its like that for every other race
3008 days, 8 hours, 55 minutes ago
View chaos1357's profile
chaos1357
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Exactly Sirius.  In my completed game, where I was Feds, I built :

LDSF (of course)
Nebulas
Lokis
Diplomacys
Missouris
Novas
Kittyhawks
The bioscanner scout
A single Arkham (or however it's spelled)
Merlin (or was it 2?)
MDSF (for when a LDSF is overkill, or you can't afford 2 Twarp engines but you need to haul some cargo)
Both terraformers


Each ship was built for a role... except really the Arkham... built it for testing purposes, likely wouldn't do it next time).  If ESB was on, I would have built some Thors too.

Result?  finished 2nd (my ally finished 1st).  Bulk of my fleet was, of course, Missouris and Diplomacys.  (my only active neighbor was the Liz, my other neighbors dropped before initiating any action against each other).  Against the Liz, the Missouri is good enough.. and you can get 2 Missouris for the cost of a Nova (minerals were the only thing slowing me down).

For almost any race, the same will be true.  Yes, there are a number of useless ships in everyone's ship list.  However, if you are only buildng 2 or 3 classes of ships, odds are you are missing a potentially critical ability.
3007 days, 10 hours, 19 minutes ago
View madinson's profile
madinson
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Well very good report.

I have some tips too:

Playing the Empire, Rebel or Borg: Built as much Hyperjump-Ships as you can. It doesn*t matter which engine they have- Warp6 is enough. The probes doesn't use as much fuel if you run them 1 turn at 8...
For sure, you have to built Large Deep Space Freighters (LDF) as Empire, but I'm used to built 2 Super Star Destroyer as first and send them as far as possible ( but try to built as much bases as soon as possible, start from there probes again).

As Cyborg you can use several tactics: Send out 2 Fireclouds in the first 2 turns, then probes. Try to built a second base immediatly, to send out probes.
....thee are several tactics.

For all empires without hyperjump ships here is the massive Expansion guide:
Engine 10, Hulls 3, Defense up to 100 (at least), Mines up to 250, Factories up to maximum, and send out a Medium Freighter (MDF) each turn, in every direction, fill it with 100 clans, 100 supplies + 100 MC, set down 1 clan at the first planet, visit the next and come back with minerals. If you found a good planet, built a Large Deep Freighter (LDF), built the second base: Engines 10, Hulls 3, send out MDF again....
Later you can recycle the Freighters at home, you got 1 Warp9-enine back.
Be sure, you will have enough minerals at home to built your first Merlin and then Combat Ships.....
3007 days, 5 hours, 52 minutes ago
View bondservant's profile
bondservant
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Madison reminds me of another piece of advice for newcomers. Regarding borders. And peace agreements. Make them. And trying to find a "fair" border usually works best. Just keep in mind that four races can travel faster than others. Just because your neighbor colonized a planet with their HYP ship or gravatonic ship, it does not mean they deserve to keep it. This could cause some early tension with your neighbor, so just calmly explain why you are taking their planet and that you DO want to establish a peace agreement with a FAIR border.
2998 days, 3 hours, 29 minutes ago
View capnkill's profile
capnkill
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Its amazing how many people are guilty of this:

Trick (thanks to veldan for reminding me this): When the next planet is 2 jumps away from your ship location, dont move directly to that planet. Select instead a waypoint between the 2 planets. This way the enemy will not be able to see where u are coming from, as ur ship will appear as just sitting in space
2997 days, 20 hours, 15 minutes ago
View veldan's profile
veldan
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
I've gotten lazy recently on that one.  It was easier to do when I played using VPA... now if I forget where the ship came from I have to jump in my dolorean, accelerate to 88 mph, hope i brought plutonium for the return trip, and then when I get back I forget what ship I was concerned about in the first place.
2883 days, 5 hours, 4 minutes ago
View mugulor's profile
mugulor
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
One thing I do that most people seem to recommend the opposite is traveling with minimum fuel to reach your destination. I always travel with more fuel than I need to get to my destination because
nothing is worse than having your enemy interrupt your plans with their own.

That is not to say you should travel with full tanks, but you should at least leave yourself the flexibility to change destination, counter attack an unexpected move or retreat to safety.

There are exceptions to this, for instance on a ship that is going to hit an immobile target like a star base the next turn and the ship won't survive I will make sure it has only enough fuel to get there and fight. Or if you are playing in a low mineral game fuel consumption counts a lot more.

2881 days, 9 hours, 58 minutes ago
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zelrik
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
A note on the defense posts. I have seen people max'ing the starbase defense, It is generally a bad idea. Planetary defense first > build fighters > if you have so much cash that you don't know what to do with, then maybe it's ok to raise the starbase defense. Usually, you are much better off spending money on good ships to defend that starbase attack, if you are defending, you are already losing :).

2881 days, 4 hours, 21 minutes ago
View rudel's profile
rudel
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
I would like to add a general thing about the game. Regardless of your first impression, it is not a single player game. In most cases, you cannot win if you are on your own. You need an ally. 

This is important. Not only because 2 people can annihilate one opponent really quick. Even more important is the fact that you get access to the ships of another race. If you do not find a proper ally fast, than at least try and trade yourself some ships.

There are several ships nearly everyone needs. I give you some examples: 

Fed: Planet terraformers (to cool/heat the planet >14 or <85°), Loki
Lizard: Terraformer (only for cooling), Loki
Bird: Resolute
Fascist: a Glory Device could come really handy when going against the Privateer or you a planet with a lot of Amorphous
Privateer: Any ship with a Grav. Accelerator will be good, MCBR being the top of the line
Borg: Give Fireclouds! :)
Crystal: Maybe the Onyx for terraforming
Empire, Rebel: Probes are always good, Falcon a supreme expansion ship
Robot: Difficult... maybe an Instrumentaliy
Colonies: Cobol

Now you need to decide first, what type of engines and armanent you need. Because you have to pay double the amount of MCs when cloning. If the ship you want isn't relying on his engines (unlike i.e. the MCBR), it might be better to ask for an engine 7 ship. It's much cheaper!

2880 days, 5 hours, 51 minutes ago
View capnkill's profile
capnkill
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Don't forget the Loki for Feds / Liz
2879 days, 15 hours, 22 minutes ago
View halion's profile
halion
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply

Rudel I would agree with your encouragement to not think of this as a single player game however don't limit it to just the ships that others have.

Pretty much every unique ability a race has makes a worthy benefit for an ally so yes ships are important considersation but i noticed you struggled with robots as an example(when only talking about ships)..

If you mentioned that they build free fighters and have x4 mines then they become quite attractive to many other races as an ally etc.

I know you know this but since this is a thread for newcomers i wanted to make the point ;)

2878 days, 11 hours, 35 minutes ago
View rudel's profile
rudel
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
@capnkill: I added the Lokis
@Halion: That's surely a good addition. 

My list should only give new users a brief guideline what they good achieve by trading ships. Of course there are several more advanced issues you have to think about. Some examples: 

- you found an Insectoid Unity planet with 98°? Get a terraformer asap! (unless you have a Bovi 9m right next to it ;) )
- you are next to the Privateer? Loki would be a good idea...
- you play with the Lizard and realize that a badass fighter race on the other side of the universe expands freely (because as always some players show subzero skills or quit the game early) - try to get a big ship yourself, preferably a Biocide or Gorbie. You should have the money to clone it! Even better: forge an alliance. 
- you play the Empire and your neighbouring cloaker race behaves strange: get a decent minelayer somewhere fast! Even better: get the Robots or Crystal people as your friend and let them take care. 

The list should not be the ultimate tool to choose the ships you need.  It's more a basic approach what ships COULD be useful in general. You need to monitor your starting position, your planets and your neighbours and evaluate a diplomatic strategy. Do this early. 
2878 days, 2 hours, 48 minutes ago
View capnkill's profile
capnkill
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Should also maybe rank the ships in order of value.  Trading away a Firecloud for example early in the game is not the same as trading away a terraformer :)

Same with Graviton ships... there's certain ships that I would NEVER trade unless I have a full alliance with someone.

Like giving the Crystals a cloaker with good tubes.  Or if you give the Crystals a cloaker with crappy tubes or no tubes, make sure they aren't friends with the Feds. 

Lots to think about :)
2876 days, 22 hours, 47 minutes ago
View capnkill's profile
capnkill
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
Quick note on the first post, probably already covered, but just in case:

1. Engines:

Engines 6+ are ok in a crunch for Graviton ships, but when possible always go TWarp

2. Freighters

MDSFs get a bad rap, I think they can be very useful in moving minerals from those so-so non native planets.  Lets face it, your usually just out of one mineral, so a MDSF can grab 200 of that for you.  I only build these when I don't have enough for LDSFs or whatever, but if you are in a bind and can't think of anything good to build, an MDSF with 1 TWarp is not such a bad option.

3. Combat Ships

Fascists: I wouldn't buld the death specula, its just too light

Crystals: Since you never fight with these ships I'd addd teh Ruby in there as well.  Ruby / Emerald, they both have tons of cargo.

Also on the Crystals, build Opals, LOTS of them, they are insanely useful until the very end of the game.  Those are the ships you use to spawn the mini fields which will assist you in dropping the massive overlapping fields.
2835 days, 19 hours, 34 minutes ago
View mycroft's profile
mycroft
RE: Fast guide for newcomersWrite Reply
I personally agree, if you have the ability to use Tech 10 engines you should. In the beginning of the game fuel is usually on the short stick. Use what you have to the most effectiveness. Remember the more planets you get to the more starting fuel you have and the less your foes have.

As far as which freighters to use, it depends on what your looking to move. The smaller the ship the more efficient the fuel is. I.E. a MDSF is more effective at moving 200 Cargo then a LDSF moving only 200. However, 1200 cargo is much easier to move and is more cost effective with one pass, one ship then 6 passes one ship. So look at how much you anticipate moving and use that which fits the task best.

Always move to a planet, and if you cannot move to a center point of the planets you are moving between. This will make it difficult to determine where you are going and coming from and it makes it harder to determine what is of value. I've been playing this game for only 2-3 months. But usually when I take a HW, its because someone pointed a red line away from it, or because there was a lot of ship activity obviously near it.

As far as building a higher tier warship early, it depends on your tactical situation. I've eliminated a HW on turn 7 with a resolute because its location was compromised by ship movement. I would gladly take more breathing room and a crippled foe to 2-3 more decent ships that will prolly have to be sacrificed to the same ends anyways. I wouldn't advise going straight off to these warships, because then your not going to be able to cover all your approaches. But if there is a good enough prize, roll your dice.

Also, don't lay mines on your homeworld. Never do so until you know its location is either compromised, or is no longer strategically critical. Laying mines will generally attract curiosity. Especially if its only at one point. If its worth guarding obviously, then its obviously worth checking out.

Also, I was a tax at the 10% or w/e to keep at 100 happiness all the time believer. But moving to 30% wait a few then 30% will max out your colonists much quicker. make sure you don't tax like that for more then 1 turn or you might find that planet economically dead for a few turns. Remember, if situation dictates, if your planet is at 70+ you can always tax it back down to 70 to have a few more mines/torps/ships to compensate with your situation.